QUINTANILLA: Good evening, I’m Carl
Quintanilla, with my colleagues Becky Quick and John Harwood.
We’ll be joined tonight by some of CNBC’s top experts on the
markets and personal finance.
QUINTANILLA: Let’s get through the rules of
the road. Candidates get 30 seconds to answer the opening
question, 60 seconds to answer a formal question, 30 seconds for
follow-ups and rebuttals, all at the discretion of the
moderators.
We want you to weigh in from home. You’ll see
your tweets at the bottom of the screen. Use the hashtag, #cNBCgopdebate.
You can also go to cNBC.com/vote to tell us where you stand
throughout the night.
So let’s introduce the candidates for
tonight’s Republican presidential debate. On the stage from left
to right, Governor John Kasich.
(APPLAUSE)
Governor Mike Huckabee.
(APPLAUSE)
Governor Jeb Bush.
(APPLAUSE)
Senator Marco Rubio.
(APPLAUSE)
Mr. Donald Trump.
(APPLAUSE)
Dr. Ben Carson.
(APPLAUSE)
Mrs. Carly Fiorina.
(APPLAUSE)
Senator Ted Cruz.
(APPLAUSE)
Governor Chris Christie.
(APPLAUSE) And Senator Rand Paul.
(APPLAUSE)
A lot to get to tonight. So let’s get started.
This first is an open question.
This series of debates is essentially a job
interview with the American people. And in any job interview,
you know this: you get asked, “what’s your biggest weakness?” So
in 30 seconds, without telling us that you try too hard or that
you’re a perfectionist…
(LAUGHTER)
…what is your biggest weakness and what are
you doing to address it? We’ll go left to right. Governor
Kasich, 30 seconds.
KASICH: Good question, but I want to tell you,
my great concern is that we are on the verge, perhaps, of
picking someone who cannot do this job.
I’ve watched to see people say that we should
dismantle Medicare and Medicaid and leave the senior citizens
out — out in the — in the cold. I’ve heard them talk about
deporting 10 or 11 — people here from this country out of this
country, splitting families. I’ve heard about tax schemes that
don’t add up, that put our kids in — in a deeper hole than they
are today.
We need somebody who can lead. We need
somebody who can balance budgets, cut taxes…
QUINTANILLA: Governor?
KASICH: You know, frankly, I did it in
Washington, in Ohio, and I will do it again in Washington, if
I’m president, to get this country moving again.
KASICH: country moving again.
QUINTANILLA: Governor Huckabee.
HUCKABEE: Well, John, I don’t really have any
weaknesses that I can think of.
(LAUGHTER)
But my wife is down here in the front, and I’m
sure, if you’d like to talk to her later, she can give you more
than you’ll ever be able to take care of.
If I have a weakness, it’s that I try to live
by the rules. I try to live by the rules, no matter what they
are, and I was brought up that way as a kid. Play by the rules.
And I’ll tell you what a weakness is of this
country: there are a lot of people who are sick and tired
because Washington does not play by the same rules that the
American people have to play by.
QUINTANILLA: Thank you, Governor. Governor
Bush.
BUSH: You know, I am by my nature impatient.
And this is not an endeavor that rewards that. You gotta be
patient. You gotta be — stick with it, and all that.
But also, I can’t fake anger. I believe this
is still the most extraordinary country on the face of the
Earth. And it troubles me that people are rewarded for tearing
down our country. It’s never been that way in American politics
before.
BUSH: I can’t do it. I just don’t believe that
this country’s days are going to be deeply — you know, going
down. I think we’re on the verge of the greatest time, and I
want to fix the things to let people rise up.
QUINTANILLA: Senator Rubio.
RUBIO: Thank you for that question. I would
begin by saying that I’m not sure it’s a weakness, but I do
believe that I share a sense of optimism for America’s future
that, today, is eroding from too many of our people.
I think there’s a sense in this country today
that somehow our best days are behind us. And that doesn’t have
to be true.
Our greatest days lie ahead if we are willing
to do what it takes now. If we’re willing to do what it takes
now, the 21st century is going to be the new American century,
greater than any other era we’ve had in the history of this
great nation.
QUINTANILLA: Mr. Trump?
TRUMP: I think maybe my greatest weakness is
that I trust people too much. I’m too trusting. And when they
let me down, if they let me down, I never forgive. I find it
very, very hard to forgive people that deceived me. So I don’t
know if you would call that a weakness, but my wife said “let
up.”
(LAUGHTER)
QUINTANILLA: Dr. Carson?
CARSON: Probably in terms of the applying for
the job of president, a weakness would be not really seeing
myself in that position until hundreds of thousands of people
began to tell me that I needed to do it. I do, however, believe
in Reagan’s 11th commandment, and will not be engaging in awful
things about my compatriots here.
And recognizing that it’s so important, this
election, because we’re talking about America for the people
versus America for the government.
QUINTANILLA: Mrs. Fiorina?
FIORINA: Well, gee, after the last debate, I
was told that I didn’t smile enough. (LAUGHTER)
QUINTANILLA: Fixed it.
FIORINA: But I also think that these are very
serious times; 75 percent of the American people think the
federal government is corrupt. I agree with them. And this big
powerful, corrupt bureaucracy works now only for the big, the
powerful, the wealthy and the well-connected. Meantime, wages
have stagnated for 40 years. We have more Americans out of work
or just Americans who quit looking for work for 40 years.
Ours was intended to be a citizen government.
This is about more than replacing a D with an R. We need a
leader who will help us take our government back.
QUINTANILLA: Senator Cruz?
CRUZ: I’m too agreeable, easy going.
(LAUGHTER)
You know, I think my biggest weakness is
exactly the opposite. I’m a fighter. I am passionate about what
I believe. I’ve been passionate my whole life about the
Constitution. And, you know, for six-and-a-half years, we’ve had
a gigantic party. If you want someone to grab a beer with, I may
not be that guy. But if you want someone to drive you home, I
will get the job done and I will get you home.
QUINTANILLA: Governor Christie?
CHRISTIE: I don’t see a lot of weakness on
this stage, quite frankly. Where I see the weakness is in those
three people that are left on the Democratic stage. You know, I
see a socialist, an isolationist and a pessimist. And for the
sake of me, I can’t figure out which one is which.
(LAUGHTER)
But I will — but I will tell you this, the
socialist says they’re going to pay for everything and give you
everything for free, except they don’t say they’re going to
raise it through taxes to 90 percent to do it. The isolationist
is the one who wants to continue to follow a foreign policy that
has fewer democracies today than when Barack Obama came into
office around the world.
But I know who the pessimist is. It’s Hillary
Clinton. And you put me on that stage against her next
September, she won’t get within 10 miles of the White House.
Take it to the bank.
QUINTANILLA: Senator Paul?
PAUL: You know, I left my medical practice and
ran for office because I was concerned about an $18 trillion
debt. We borrow a million dollars a minute. Now, on the floor of
the Congress, the Washington establishment from both parties
puts forward a bill that will explode the deficit. It allows
President Obama to borrow unlimited amounts of money.
I will stand firm. I will spend every ounce of
energy to stop it. I will begin tomorrow to filibuster it. And I
ask everyone in America to call Congress tomorrow and say enough
is enough; no more debt.
QUINTANILLA: Thanks to all the candidates.
John?
HARWOOD: Mr. Trump, you’ve done very well in
this campaign so far by promising to build a wall and make
another country pay for it.
TRUMP: Right.
HARWOOD: Send 11 million people out of the
country. Cut taxes $10 trillion without increasing the deficit.
TRUMP: Right.
HARWOOD: And make Americans better off because
your greatness would replace the stupidity and incompetence of
others.
TRUMP: That’s right.
HARWOOD: Let’s be honest.
(LAUGHTER)
Is this a comic book version of a presidential
campaign?
TRUMP: No, not a comic book, and it’s not a
very nicely asked question the way you say that.
Larry Kudlow is an example, who I have a lot
of respect for, who loves my tax plan. We’re reducing taxes to
15 percent. We’re bringing corporate taxes down, bringing money
back in, corporate inversions. We have $2.5 trillion outside of
the United States which we want to bring back in.
As far as the wall is concerned, we’re going
to build a wall. We’re going to create a border. We’re going to
let people in, but they’re going to come in legally. They’re
going to come in legally. And it’s something that can be done,
and I get questioned about that. They built the great wall of
China. That’s 13,000 miles. Here, we actually need 1,000 because
we have natural barriers. So we need 1,000.
TRUMP: We can do a wall. We’re going to have a
big, fat beautiful door right in the middle of the wall. We’re
going to have people come in, but they’re coming in legally. And
Mexico’s going to pay for the wall because Mexico — I love the
Mexican people; I respect the Mexican leaders — but the leaders
are much sharper, smarter and more cunning than our leaders.
And just to finish, people say, how will you
get Mexico to pay? A politician other than the people in the
states — I don’t want to — a politician cannot get them to pay.
I can. We lose, we have a trade imbalance…
Excuse me, John.
… of $50 billion…
HARWOOD: We’re at the 60 seconds.
TRUMP: … believe me the world is peanuts by
comparison.
HARWOOD: We’re at 60 seconds, but I gotta ask
you, you talked about your tax plan. You say that it would not
increase the deficit because you cut taxes $10 trillion in the
economy would take off like…
(CROSSTALK)
HARWOOD: Hold on, hold on. The economy would
take off like a rocket ship.
TRUMP: Right. Dynamically.
HARWOOD: I talked to economic advisers who
have served presidents of both parties. They said that you have
as chance of cutting taxes that much without increasing the
deficit as you would of flying away from that podium by flapping
your arms.
TRUMP: Then you have to get rid of Larry
Kudlow, who sits on your panel, who’s a great guy, who came out
the other day and said, I love Trump’s tax plan.
(CROSSTALK)
HARWOOD: The Tax Foundation says — has looked
at all of our plans and — and his creates, even with the dynamic
effect, $8 trillion dollar deficit… QUICK: Gentlemen — we’ll —
we’ll get back to this — just a minute — just a minute we’re
gonna continue this.
I wanna talk taxes…
QUINTANILLA: Hold it. We’ll cut it back to you
in just a minute. Becky’s moving on.
QUICK: Dr. Carson, let’s talk about taxes.
You have a flat tax plan of 10 percent flat
taxes, and — I’ve looked at it — and this is something that is
very appealing to a lot of voters, but I’ve had a really tough
time trying to make the math work on this.
If you were to took a 10 percent tax, with the
numbers right now in total personal income, you’re gonna come in
with bring in $1.5 trillion. That is less than half of what we
bring in right now. And by the way, it’s gonna leave us in a $2
trillion hole.
So what analysis got you to the point where
you think this will work?
CARSON: Well, first of all, I didn’t say that
the rate would be 10 percent. I used the tithing analogy.
QUICK: I — I understand that, but if you — if
you look at the numbers you probably have to get to 28.
CARSON: The rate — the rate — the rate is
gonna be much closer to 15 percent.
QUICK: 15 percent still leaves you with a $1.1
trillion hole.
CARSON: You also have to get rid of all the
deductions and all the loopholes. You also have to some
strategically cutting in several places.
Remember, we have 645 federal agencies and
sub-agencies. Anybody who tells me that we need every penny and
every one of those is in a fantasy world.
So, also, we can stimulate the economy. That’s
gonna be the real growth engine. Stimulating the economy —
because it’s tethered down right now with so many regulations…
QUICK: You’d have to cut — you’d have to cut
government about 40 percent to make it work with a $1.1 trillion
hole.
CARSON: That’s not true.
QUICK: That is true, I looked at the numbers.
CARSON: When — when we put all the facts down,
you’ll be able to see that it’s not true, it works out very
well.
QUICK: Dr. Carson, thank you.
KASICH: Listen, I want to just comment.
HARWOOD: Governor Kasich, hold it, I’m coming
to you right now. The…
KASICH: Well I want to comment on this. This
is the fantasy…
HARWOOD: Well, I’m asking you about this.
KASICH: This is the fantasy that I talked
about in the beginning.
HARWOOD: I’m about to ask you about this.
That is, you had some very strong words to say
yesterday about what’s happening in your party and what you’re
hearing from the two gentlemen we’ve just heard from. Would you
repeat it?
KASICH: I’m the only person on this stage that
actually was involved in the chief architect of balancing the
Federal Budget.
You can’t do it with empty promised. You know,
these plans would put us trillions and trillions of dollars in
debt.
I actually have a plan. I’m the only one on
this stage that has a plan that would create jobs, cut taxes,
balance the budget and can get it done because I’m realistic.
You just don’t make promises like this.
Why don’t we just give a chicken in every pot,
while we’re, you know, coming up — coming up with these fantasy
tax schemes. We’ll just clean it up. Where are you gonna clean
it up?
You have to deal with entitlements, you have
to be in a position to control discretionary spending. You gotta
be creative and imaginative.
Now, let me just be clear, John. I went into
Ohio where we had an $8 billion hole and now we have a $2
billion surplus. We’re up 347,000 jobs.
When I was in Washington, I fought to get the
budget balanced. I was the architect. It was the first time we
did it since man walked on the moon. We cut taxes and we had a
$5 trillion projected surplus when I left.
That’s was hard work. Fiscal discipline, know
what you’re doing. Creativity.
This stuff is fantasy. Just like getting rid
of Medicare and Medicaid. Come on, that’s just not — you scare
senior citizens with that. It’s not responsible.
HARWOOD: Well, let’s just get more pointed
about it. You said yesterday that you were hearing proposals
that were just crazy from your colleagues.
Who were you talking about?
KASICH: Well, I mean right here. To talk about
we’re just gonna have a 10 percent tithe and that’s how we’re
gonna fund the government? And we’re going to just fix
everything with waste, fraud, and abuse? Or that we’re just
going to be great? Or we’re going to ship 10 million Americans —
or 10 million people out of this country, leaving their children
here in this country and dividing families?
Folks, we’ve got to wake up. We cannot elect
somebody that doesn’t know how to do the job. You have got to
pick somebody who has experience, somebody that has the
know-how, the discipline.
And I spent my entire lifetime balancing
federal budgets, growing jobs, the same in Ohio. And I will go
back to Washington with my plan.
QUINTANILLA: Governor — Governor. thank you,
Governor.
KASICH: And I will have done it within 100
days, and it will pass. And we will be strong again. Thank you.
QUINTANILLA: Mr. Trump, 30 seconds.
TRUMP: First of all, John got lucky with a
thing called fracking, OK? He hit oil. He got lucky with
fracking. Believe me, that is why Ohio is doing well. Number —
and that is important for you to know.
Number two, this was the man that was a
managing general partner at Lehman Brothers when it went down
the tubes and almost took every one of us with it, including Ben
and myself, because I was there and I watched what happened.
And Lehman Brothers started it all. He was on
the board. And he was a managing general partner.
And just thirdly, he was so nice. He was such
a nice guy. And he said, oh, I’m never going to attack. But then
his poll numbers tanked. He has got — that is why he is on the
end.
(LAUGHTER) And he got nasty. And he got nasty.
So you know what? You can have him.
(CROSSTALK)
KASICH: Let me just — let me respond. First of
all, Ohio does have an energy industry, but we’re diversified.
We’re one of the fastest growing states in the country. We came
back from the dead. And you know what? It works very, very well.
And secondly, when you talk about me being on
the board of Lehman Brothers, I wasn’t on the board of Lehman
Brothers. I was a banker and I was proud of it. And I traveled
the country and learned how people made jobs.
We ought to have politicians who not only have
government experience but know how the CEOs and the job creators
work. My state is doing great across the board. And guess what,
in 2011, I got a deal…
QUICK: Governor…
KASICH: … an agreement with the…
(CROSSTALK)
KASICH: … that he tried to take credit for
four years later. It’s a joke.
QUINTANILLA: Thank you, Governor.
QUICK: Dr. Carson, let me get 30 seconds with
Dr. Carson…
(CROSSTALK)
CARSON: Since I was attacked too.
QUICK: Thank you.
CARSON: Let me just say, if you’re talking
about an $18 trillion economy, you’re talking about a 15 percent
tax on your gross domestic product. You’re talking about $2.7
trillion. We have a budget closer to $3.5 trillion.
But if you also apply that same 15 percent to
several other things, including corporate taxes, and including
the capital gains taxes, you make that amount up pretty quickly.
So that is not by any stretch a pie in the sky.
CRUZ: Becky, if you want a 10 percent flat tax
where the numbers add up, I rolled out my tax plan today, you
can find it on line at tedcruz.org. It is a simple flat tax
where for individuals, a family of four pays nothing on the
first $36,000.
After that you pay 10 percent as a flat tax
going up. The billionaire and the working man, no hedge fund
manager pays less than his secretary.
On top of that, there is a business flat tax
of 16 percent. Now that applies universally to giant
corporations that with lobbyists right now are not paying taxes,
and as small business.
And you wanted to know the numbers, the Tax
Foundation, which has scored every one of our plans, shows that
this plan will allow the economy to generate 4.9 million jobs,
to raise wages over 12 percent, and to generate 14 percent
growth.
And it costs, with dynamic scoring, less than
a trillion dollars. Those are the hard numbers. And every single
income decile sees a double-digit increase in after-tax income.
QUICK: Senator — Senator, thank you.
CRUZ: Growth is the answer. And as Reagan
demonstrated, if we cut taxes, we can bring back growth.
QUICK: Gentlemen, I’m sorry, we need to…
(CROSSTALK)
QUINTANILLA: We’re going to try to move on.
(CROSSTALK)
FIORINA: Let me just say on taxes, how long
have we been talking about tax reform in Washington, D.C.? We
have been talking about it for decades. We now have a
73,000-page tax code.
There have been more than 4,000 changes to the
tax plan since 2001 alone. There are loads of great ideas, great
conservative ideas from wonderful think tanks about how to
reform the tax code.
The problem is we never get it done. We have
talked about tax reform in every single election for decades. It
never happens. And the politicians always say it is so
complicated, nobody but a politician can figure it out.
The truth is this, the big problem, we need a
leader in Washington who understands how to get something done,
not to talk about it, not to propose it, to get it done.
QUINTANILLA: You want to bring 70,000 pages to
three?
FIORINA: That’s right, three pages.
QUINTANILLA: Is that using really small type?
FIORINA: You know why three?
QUINTANILLA: Is that using really small type?
FIORINA: No. You know why three? Because only
if it’s about three pages are you leveling the playing field
between the big, the powerful, the wealthy and the
well-connected who can hire the armies of lawyers and
accountants and, yes, lobbyists to help them navigate their way
through 73,000 pages.
Three pages is about the maximum that a single
business owner or a farmer or just a couple can understand
without hiring somebody. Almost 60 percent of American people
now need to hire an expert to understand their taxes.
So yes, you’re going to hear a lot of talk
about tax reform —
QUINTANILLA: Mrs. Fiorina —
FIORINA: — the issue is who is going to get it
done.
(CROSSTALK)
QUINTANILLA: We’re going to —
QUICK: We’re going to move on.
QUINTANILLA: We will come around the bend, i
promise. This one is for Senator Rubio. You’ve been a young man
in a hurry ever since you won your first election in your 20s.
You’ve had a big accomplishment in the Senate, an immigration
bill providing a path to citizenship the conservatives in your
party hate, and even you don’t support anymore. Now, you’re
skipping more votes than any senator to run for president. Why
not slow down, get a few more things done first or least finish
what you start?
RUBIO: That’s an interesting question. That’s
exactly what the Republican establishment says too. Why don’t
you wait in line? Wait for what? This country is running out of
time. We can’t afford to have another four years like the last
eight years.
Watching this broadcast tonight are millions
of people that are living paycheck to paycheck. They’re working
as hard as they ever have, everything costs more, and they
haven’t had a raise in decades.
You have small businesses in America that are
struggling. For the first time in 35 years, we have more
businesses closing than starting. We have a world that’s out of
control and has grown dangerous and a president that is
weakening our military and making our foreign policy unstable
and unreliable in the eyes of our allies. And our adversaries
continue to grow stronger.
We have a — they say there’s no bipartisanship
in Washington? We have a $19 trillion bipartisan debt and it
continues to grow as we borrow money from countries that do not
like us to pay for government we cannot afford.
The time to act is now. The time to turn the
page is now. If we — if we don’t act now, we are going to be the
first generation in American history that leaves our children
worse off than ourselves.
QUINTANILLA: So when the Sun-Sentinel says
Rubio should resign, not rip us off, when they say Floridians
sent you to Washington to do a job, when they say you act like
you hate your job, do you?
RUBIO: Let me say, I read that editorial today
with a great amusement. It’s actually evidence of the bias that
exists in the American media today.
QUINTANILLA: Well, do you hate your job?
RUBIO: Let me — let me answer your question on
the Sun-Sentinel editorial today. Back in 2004, one of my
predecessors to the Senate by the name of Bob Graham, a
Democrat, ran for president missing over 30 percent of his
votes. I don’t recall them calling for his resignation —
QUINTANILLA: Is that the standard?
RUBIO: Later that year, in 2004, John Kerry
ran for president missing close to 60 to 70 percent of his
votes. I don’t recall the Sun — in fact, the Sun-Sentinel
endorsed him. In 2008, Barack Obama missed 60 or 70 percent of
his votes, and the same newspaper endorsed him again. So this is
another example of the double standard that exists in this
country between the mainstream media and the conservative
movement.
(APPLAUSE)
QUINTANILLA: Senator, thank you. John.
BUSH: Could I — could I bring something up
here, because I’m a constituent of the senator and I helped him
and I expected that he would do constituent service, which means
that he shows up to work. He got endorsed by the Sun-Sentinel
because he was the most talented guy in the field. He’s a gifted
politician.
But Marco, when you signed up for this, this
was a six-year term, and you should be showing up to work. I
mean, literally, the Senate — what is it, like a French work
week? You get, like, three days where you have to show up? You
can campaign, or just resign and let someone else take the job.
There are a lot of people living paycheck to paycheck in Florida
as well, they’re looking for a senator that will fight for them
each and every day.
RUBIO: I get to respond, right?
QUICK: Thirty seconds.
RUBIO: Well, it’s interesting. Over the last
few weeks, I’ve listened to Jeb as he walked around the country
and said that you’re modeling your campaign after John McCain,
that you’re going to launch a furious comeback the way he did,
by fighting hard in New Hampshire and places like that, carrying
your own bag at the airport. You know how many votes John McCain
missed when he was carrying out that furious comeback that
you’re now modeling after?
BUSH: He wasn’t my senator.
RUBIO: No Jeb, I don’t remember — well, let me
tell you. I don’t remember you ever complaining about John
McCain’s vote record. The only reason why you’re doing it now is
because we’re running for the same position, and someone has
convinced you that attacking me is going to help you.
BUSH: Well, I’ve been —
RUBIO: Here’s the bottom line.
(APPLAUSE)
I’m not — my campaign is going to be about the
future of America, it’s not going to be about attacking anyone
else on this stage. I will continue to have tremendous
admiration and respect for Governor Bush. I’m not running
against Governor Bush, I’m not running against anyone on this
stage. I’m running for president because there is no way we can
elect Hillary Clinton to continue the policies of Barack Obama.
QUINTANILLA: Thank you, Senator.
TRUMP: I think you’re —
(APPLAUSE)
(CROSSTALK)
HARWOOD: Hold on. I think there’s a — I’ve got
question for —
(CROSSTALK)
KASICH: John Harwood, there’s a bigger issue
here.
HARWOOD: Hold on, Governor. I’ve got a
question for Governor Bush.
(CROSSTALK)
HARWOOD: No, we’re moving to Governor Bush.
Governor, the fact that you’re at the fifth lectern tonight
shows how far your stock has fallen in this race, despite the
big investment your donors have made.
HARWOOD: You noted recently, after slashing
your payroll, that you had better things to do than sit around
and be demonized by other people. I wanted to ask you —
BUSH: No, no. What I said was I don’t believe
that I would be president of the United States and have the same
dysfunction that exists in Washington, D.C. now.
HARWOOD: OK.
BUSH: Don’t vote for me if you want to keep
the gridlock in Washington, D.C.
HARWOOD: Got it.
BUSH: But if you want someone who has a
proven, effective leadership, that was a governor of a state,
that transformed the culture there, elect me so I can fight for
the American people and change the culture in Washington, D.C.
HARWOOD: But it’s a — OK. It’s a — it’s a
question about why you’re having difficulty. I want to ask you
in this context.
Ben Bernanke, who was appointed Fed chairman
by your brother, recently wrote a book in which he said he no
longer considers himself a Republican because the Republican
Party has given in to know- nothingism. Is that why you’re
having a difficult time in this race?
BUSH: (inaudible), the great majority of
Republicans and Americans believe in a hopeful future. They
don’t believe in building walls and a pessimistic view of the
future.
They’re concerned that Washington is so
dysfunctional it is holding them back. There are lids on
people’s aspirations. Think about it: six and a half million
people working part-time. Workforce participation rates lower
than they were in 1977.
Six million more people living in poverty than
the day that Barack Obama got elected president, and the left
just wants more of the same. We have to offer a compelling
alternative that is based on hope and optimism and grounded in
serious policy, which I’ve laid out.
And you can go get it at jeb2016.com.
HARWOOD: Thank you, Governor.
(CROSSTALK)
HARWOOD: We’re gonna get down the line.
Becky’s got a question.
QUICK: We’ll get to everyone.
Ms. Fiorina, I — I’d like to ask you a
question. You are running for president of the United States
because of your record running Hewlett-Packard. But the stock
market is usually a fair indicator of the performance of a CEO,
and the market was not kind to you.
Someone who invested a dollar in your company
the day you took office had lost half of the dollar by the day
you left. Obviously, you’ve talked in the past about what a
difficult time it was for technology companies, but anybody who
was following the market knows that your stock was a much worse
performer, if you looked at your competitors, if you looked at
the overall market.
I just wonder, in terms of all of that — you
know, we look back, your board fired you. I just wondered why
you think we should hire you now.
FIORINA: You know, the NASDAQ dropped 80
percent — 80 percent — and it took 15 years for the NASDAQ to
recover. I was recruited to H.P. to save a company.
It was a company that had grown into a
bloated, inept bureaucracy that cost too much and delivered too
little to customers and shareholders. It had missed, before I
had arrived, expectations for nine quarters in a row.
As an outsider, I tackled H.P.’s entrenched
problems head-on. I cut the bureaucracy down to size,
re-introduced accountability, focused on service, on innovation,
on leading in every market, in every product segment.
And yes, it was a very difficult time.
However, we saved 80,000 jobs and we went on to grow to 160,000
jobs, and scores of technology companies literally went out of
business — like Gateway — taking all their jobs with them.
The truth is I had to make some tough calls in
some tough times. I think, actually, people are looking for that
in Washington now. And yes, I was fired over a disagreement in
the boardroom. There are politics in the boardroom as well.
And yet the man who led my firing, Tom
Perkins, an icon of Silicon Valley, has come out publicly and
said, “you know what? We were wrong. She was right. She was a
great CEO. She’d be a great president of the United States
because the leadership she brought to H.P. is exactly the
leadership we need in Washington, D.C.
QUICK: Mrs. Fiorina, it’s interesting that you
bring up Mr. Perkins, because…
(APPLAUSE) …he said a lot of very questionable
things. Last year, in an interview, he said that he thinks
wealthy people should get more votes than poor people.
I think his quote was that, “if you pay zero
dollars in taxes, you should get zero votes. If you pay a
million dollars, you should get a million votes.” Is this the
type of person you want defending you?
FIORINA: Well, this is one of the reasons why
Tom Perkins and I had disagreements in the boardroom, Becky.
(LAUGHTER)
Nevertheless, one of the things that I think
people don’t always understand is how accountable a CEO actually
is.
So you know, I had to report results every 90
days in excruciating detail. I had to answer every single
question about every single result and every single projection
in public until there were no more questions.
And if I misrepresented those results or those
projections in any way, I was held criminally liable. Imagine —
imagine — if a politician were held to that standard of account.
I will run on my record all day long.
(APPLAUSE)
And I believe people need a leader who is
prepared to make tough calls in tough times and stand up…
QUICK: Mrs. Fiorina.
FIORINA: …and be held accountable.
QUICK: Thank you, we’re out of time. Thank
you, Mrs. Fiorina.
Carl.
QUINTANILLA: Senator Cruz. Congressional
Republicans, Democrats and the White House are about to strike a
compromise that would raise the debt limit, prevent a government
shutdown and calm financial markets that fear of — another
Washington-created crisis is on the way.
Does your opposition to it show that you’re
not the kind of problem-solver American voters want?
CRUZ: You know, let me say something at the
outset. The questions that have been asked so far in this debate
illustrate why the American people don’t trust the media.
(APPLAUSE) This is not a cage match. And, you
look at the questions — “Donald Trump, are you a comic-book
villain?” “Ben Carson, can you do math?” “John Kasich, will you
insult two people over here?” “Marco Rubio, why don’t you
resign?” “Jeb Bush, why have your numbers fallen?”
How about talking about the substantive issues
the people care about?
(APPLAUSE)
QUINTANILLA: (inaudible) do we get credit
(inaudible)?
CRUZ: And Carl — Carl, I’m not finished yet.
CRUZ: The contrast with the Democratic debate,
where every fawning question from the media was, “Which of you
is more handsome and why?”
(LAUGHTER)
And let me be clear.
(CROSSTALK)
QUINTANILLA: So, this is a question about
(inaudible), which you have 30 seconds left to answer, should
you choose to do so.
CRUZ: Let me be clear. The men and women on
this stage have more ideas, more experience, more common sense
than every participant in the Democratic debate. That debate
reflected a debate between the Bolsheviks and the Mensheviks.
(LAUGHTER)
And nobody watching at home believed that any
of the moderators had any intention of voting in a Republican
primary. The questions that are being asked shouldn’t be trying
to get people to tear into each other. It should be what are
your substantive positions…
(CROSSTALK)
QUINTANILLA: OK. (inaudible) I asked you about
the debt limit and I got no answer.
(CROSSTALK)
CRUZ: You want me to answer that question? I’m
happy to answer the question…
(CROSSTALK)
CRUZ: Let me tell you how that question…
(CROSSTALK)
CRUZ: Let me tell you how that question…
(CROSSTALK)
HARWOOD: Senator Paul, I’ve got a question for
you on the same subject.
CRUZ: … so you don’t actually want to hear the
answer, John?
HARWOOD: Senator Paul?
CRUZ: You don’t want to hear the answer. You
just want to…
(CROSSTALK)
HARWOOD: You used your time on something else.
Senator Paul?
CRUZ: You’re not interested in an answer.
(CROSSTALK)
HARWOOD: Senator Paul, the budget deal crafted
by Speaker Boehner and passed by the House today makes cuts in
entitlement programs, Medicare and Social Security disability,
which are the very programs conservatives say need cutting to
shrink government and solve our country’s long-term budget
deficit. Do you oppose that budget deal because it doesn’t cut
those programs enough?
PAUL: No, I oppose it because you’re taking
money from the entitlement and then spending it immediately on
other items. That’s what they’re doing. They’re taking money
from Social Security and they’re going to spend it on the
military and they’re going to spend it on domestic spending.
Here’s the thing. When you look at raising the
debt limit, it should be leverage to try to reform government.
In 2011, the sequester was passed as a reform to slow down the
rate of government. Instead, the Washington establishment raised
both. We raised the military spending, took from entitlements,
and raised domestic spending and the deficit will explode under
this. This is the unholy alliance that people need to know about
between right and left. Right and left are spending us into
oblivion. We should use the debt ceiling, as precisely to Don,
to force upon them budgetary reforms.
HARWOOD: Senator, if what you just said is
true, why did Speaker Boehner craft this deal and why did Paul
Ryan, who has a strong reputation for fiscal discipline, vote
for it?
PAUL: Well, that’s a real question. Is there
going to be any change in the House with new leadership? I
frankly don’t think there will be much change because I think
what’s going to happen is you’re going to get more of the same.
People in Washington think they were sent there to be adults and
govern and do all this. Well, you know what I’m worried about?
Not keeping the government open. I’m worried about bankrupting
the American people.
We’re borrowing a million dollars a minute.
That is important. And that’s what we have to contrast. Keeping
the government open and continuing to borrow a million dollars a
minute.
(CROSSTALK)
HARWOOD: Thank you, Senator (inaudible).
QUICK: Governor Christie, I’d like to
(inaudible) a question next. Actually, I have a question for you
(inaudible).
In your tell it like it is campaign, you’ve
said a lot of tough things. You’ve said that we need to raise
the retirement age for Social Security. You think that we need
to cut benefits for people who make over $80,000 and eliminate
them entirely for seniors who are making over $200,000.
Governor Huckabee, who is here on the stage,
has said that you and others who think this way are trying to
rob seniors of the benefits that they’ve earned. It raises the
question: When it is acceptable to break a social compact?
RITCHIE: Well, I wish you would have asked
that question years ago when they broke it. I mean, let me be
honest with the people who are watching at home. The government
has lied to you and they have stolen from you. They told you
that your Social Security money is in a trust fund. All that’s
in that trust fund is a pile of IOUs for money they spent on
something else a long time ago.
And they’ve stolen from you because now they
know they cannot pay these benefits and Social Security is going
to be insolvent in seven to eight years. We’re sitting up here
talking about all these other things; 71 percent of federal
spending today is on entitlements, and debt service. And, that’s
with zero percent interest rates.
Now, I’m the only person that’s put out a
detailed plan on how to deal with entitlements. And we’ll save a
trillion dollars over the next 10 years. And, here’s the
difference between me and Hillary Clinton. What Hillary
Clinton’s going to say, and has said before is, she wants to
raise Social Security taxes.
Now, let me ask you a question everybody, and,
this is for the guy, you know, who owns a landscaping business
out there. If somebody’s already stolen money from you, are you
going to give them more? Or, are you going to deal with the
problem by saying, I’m going to give people who’ve done well in
this country less benefit on the backend. We need to get
realistic about this. We’re not — the American people — forget
about anything else, they’ve already been lied to and stolen
from. And…
QUICK: …Governor…
CHRISTIE: …I’m going to go to Washington to
stop it…
QUICK: …Thank you.
QUINTANILLA: We promised we would get to
everyone this block. Governor Huckabee, I’m going to give you 60
seconds on this.
HUCKABEE: Well, I would really appreciate
that. First of all, yes, we’ve stolen. Yes, we’ve lied to the
American people about Social Security, and Medicare.
But, you know what we’re not telling them?
It’s their money. This isn’t the governments money. This is not
entitlement, it’s not welfare. This is money that people have
confiscated out of their paychecks. Everytime they got a
paycheck, the government reached in and took something out of it
before they ever saw it. Now, we’re going to blame the people.
Today congress decided to take another $150
billion dollars away from Social Security so they can borrow
more money. That makes no sense to everybody. And, they’re
always going to say, “Well, we’re going to fix this one day.”
No their not. It’s like a 400 pound man
saying, “I’m going to go on a diet, but I’m eating a sack of
Krispy Kremes before I do.”
And, people are sick of believing that the
government is never going to really address this. But, let me
tell you who not to blame. Let’s quit blaming the people on
Social Security. Let’s quit making it a problem for them. It’s
like them getting mugged, and then us saying, well, we’re going
to mug you some more. You ought to just be able to get over it,
get used to it…
QUINTANILLA: …Governor…
HUCKABEE: …No, sir…
QUINTANILLA: …Thank you, Governor…
HUCKABEE: …we need to honor our promises…
(CROSSTALK)
QUINTANILLA: …Senator Cruz…
HUCKABEE: …before I go. This is the only time
I’ve had a chance, let me finish.
QUINTANILLA: OK, alright.
HUCKABEE: …This is a matter not of math, this
is a matter of morality. If this country that does not keep its
promise to seniors then what promise can this country hope to be
trusted to keep? And, the fact is, none of them.
(CROSSTALK)
MALE: And, by the way, Carl…
(APPLAUSE)
HUCKABEE: And, the only way — no…
(CROSSTALK)
CHRISTIE: …The only way we’re going to be
morale, the only way we’re going to keep our promise to seniors
is start by following the first rule we should all follow, which
is to look at them, treat them like adults, and tell them the
truth.
It isn’t there anymore, Mike. They stole it.
It got stolen from them. It’s not theirs anymore. The government
stole it, and spent it a long time ago… HUCKABEE: …Chris…
CHRISTIE: So, let’s stop fooling around about
this, let’s tell people the truth. For once, let’s do that, and
stop trying to give them some kind of fantasy that’s never going
to come true.
QUINTANILLA: Senator Cruz…
HUCKABEE: …Chris…
QUINTANILLA: …Before we go to break, we’re
clearly not having that beer you mentioned, but I’ll give you 30
more seconds…
CRUZ: …Then I’ll buy you a tequila…
QUINTANILLA: OK.
CRUZ: …Or, even some famous Colorado brownies.
QUINTANILLA: I’ll give you 30 seconds to
respond…
(CHEERING)
QUINTANILLA: (INAUDIBLE)
HUCKABEE: Since he brought me up, do I not get
to respond?
QUINTANILLA: Respond on the debt limit, or an
answer to the governor, which ever you choose.
CRUZ: Well, sure. This deal in Washington is
an example of why Washington’s broken. Republican leadership
joined with every single Democrat, add $80 trillion to our debt
to do nothing to fix the problems.
And, let me now on Social Security because we
were getting into a good substantive exchange, and I want to say
I think both Chris, and Mike are right. Governor Huckabee’s
exactly right, we need to honor the promises made to our
seniors, but for younger workers — look. I’m 44 years old.
It is hard to find someone in my generation
that thinks Social Security will be there for us. We can save
and preserve and strengthen Social Security by making no changes
for seniors, but for younger workers gradually increasing the
retirement age, changing the rate of growth so that it matches
inflation, and critically allowing younger workers to keep a
portion of our tax payments in a personal account that we own,
we control them, we can pass on to our kids.
QUINTANILLA: 30 seconds, Governor Huckabee.
HUCKABEE: John, listen, let’s keep in mind
that for one-third of the 60 million Americans on Social
Security it represents 90 percent of their income. And, when I
hear people talking about means testing, let’s just remember
what that means. If we means test Social Security, it means that
the government decides whether or not I deserve it. If a person
lives in a seven room house, does the government get to say you
don’t need seven rooms, we’re going to take two of them away?
HUCKABEE: Folks, the government has no
business stealing even more from the people who have paid this
in. I just want to remind you, people paid their money. They
expect to have it. And, if this government doesn’t pay it, than
tell me what’s different between the government and Bernie
Madolf, who sits in prison today for doing less than what the
government has done to the people on social security and
Medicare in this country.
(APPLAUSE)
QUINTANILLA: Governor, thank you. We will take
a break. The Republican Presidential debate, live from Boulder,
Colorado, coming back after a break on CNBC.
(APPLAUSE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUICK: Welcome back to the presidential debate
for the Republicans. We are live in Boulder, Colorado, right
here on CNBC.
Folks, we’ll get right back into this.
Mr. Trump, let’s talk a little bit about
bankruptcies. Your Atlantic City casinos filed for bankruptcy
four times. In fact, Fitch, the ratings agency, even said that
they were serial filers for all of this. You said that you did
great with Atlantic City, and you did. But some of the
individuals — the bondholders, some of the contractors who
worked for you, didn’t fare so well.
Bankruptcy is a broken promise. Why should the
voters believe the promises that you’re telling them right now?
TRUMP: Well, first of all, like many other
very big businessmen, I could name them here, but I’m not going
to do that for a lot of obvious reasons, but the biggest, and
almost all of them, they’ve all used the chapter laws, the
bankruptcy laws to their own benefit.
Before this, I was a very successful person as
a developer and as a businessman. Atlantic City has gone bad. I
mean, Chris will know about that. I’m not blaming Chris, by the
way, but he will know about that. Caesar’s — excuse me —
Caesar’s, the Rolls-Royce, as you know, is in bankruptcy. Almost
every hotel in Atlantic City has either been in bankruptcy or
will be in bankruptcy — the biggest.
But also the biggest people (ph) — now I’ve
used that to my advantage as a business man, for my family, for
myself. I never filed for bankruptcy. But many, many people did.
What happened with Atlantic City is very, very disgraceful.
Now hundreds of companies I’ve opened. I’ve
used it three times, maybe four times. Came out great. But I
guess I’m supposed to come out great. That is what I could do
for the country. We owe $19 trillion, boy am I good at solving
debt problems. Nobody can solve it like me.
But I will tell you this, Atlantic City,
you’re using that, hundreds of companies that I have opened have
thrived. I built a net worth of way over $10 billion, and I have
done it four times out of hundreds. And I’m glad I did it.
I used the laws of the country to my benefit,
I’m sorry.
QUICK: Mr. Trump, thank you.
TRUMP: Thank you.
CRAMER: Dr. Carson, in recent weeks, a number
of pharmaceutical companies has been accused of profiteering,
for dramatically raising the prices of life-saving drugs. You
have spent a lifetime in medicine.
Have these companies gone too far? Should the
government be involved in controlling some of these price
increases?
CARSON: Well, there is no question that some
people go overboard when it comes to trying to make profits, and
they don’t take into consideration the American people. What we
have to start thinking about, as leaders, particularly in
government, is what can we do for the average American? And you
think about the reasons that we’re having such difficulty right
now with our job market.
Well, the average small manufacturer, whatever
they’re manufacturing, drugs or anything, if they have less than
50 employees, the average cost in terms of regulations is
$34,000 per employee. Makes it a whole lot easier for them to
want to go somewhere else.
So what we’re going to have to start doing
instead of, you know, picking on this group or this group, is
we’re going to have to have a major reduction in the regulatory
influence that is going on.
The government is not supposed to be in every
part of our lives, and that is what is causing the problem.
CRAMER: Thank you, Dr. Carson.
Governor Christie, there has been a lot of
political rhetoric that some bank executives should have gone to
jail for the 2008 financial crisis.
But General Motors paid more than $1 billion
in fines and settlements for its ignition switch defect. One
hundred and twenty- four people died as a result of these faulty
switches. No one went to jail.
As a former prosecutor, do you believe the
people responsible for the switch and the cover-up belong behind
bars?
CHRISTIE: You bet they do. And if I were the
prosecutor, that is exactly where they would be. The fact is
that this Justice Department under this president has been a
political Justice Department.
It has been a Justice Department that decided
that they want to pick who the winners and losers are. They like
General Motors, so they give them a pass. They don’t like
somebody else like David Petraeus, they prosecute them and send
a decorated general on to disgrace. It’s a political Justice
Department.
And, Jim, you know full well that in the seven
years I was U.S. attorney we went after pharmaceutical
companies. We went after companies that were ripping off
shareholders. We went after companies that were doing things
that were against the law.
And to expand on Mr. Carson’s — or Dr.
Carson’s question, let’s face it, we have laws already. We don’t
need newer (ph) laws. We don’t need Hillary Clinton’s price
controls for — again, does anybody out there think that giving
Washington, D.C., the opportunity to run the pharmaceutical
industry is a good idea, given how well they have done running
the government?
So what we do, though, is, if there is
somebody who is price- gouging, we have laws for prosecutors to
take that on. Let’s let a Justice Department — and I will make
an attorney general who will enforce the law and make justice
more than just a word. It will be a way of life.
CRAMER: Thank you, Governor Christie.
HARWOOD: Jim, thanks.
Governor Bush, in a debate like this four
years ago, every Republican running for president pledged to
oppose a budget deal containing any tax increase even if it had
spending cuts ten times as large.
A few months later, you told Congress, put me
in, coach, you said you would take that deal. Still feel that
way?
BUSH: Well, the deal was done. Barack Obama
got his massive tax increase, and there was no spending cuts.
You just see the recent deal announced today or yesterday, more
spending, more tax increasing, more regulation. And now we have
to accept 2 percent, the new normal for economic growth.
And the net result is the middle class has
$2,300 less in their pockets than the day that Barack Obama got
elected president. And now they see Hillary Clinton proposing a
third term of economic policy for our country.
We need to reverse that. And my record was one
of cutting taxes each and every year. You don’t have to guess
about it, because I actually have a record. $19 billion of tax
cuts, 1.3 million jobs created. We were one of two states to go
to AAA bond rating, and our government spending was far less
than the spending in people’s income.
HARWOOD: But to — to the point that you made
to Congress, if you were president and you were offered a
bipartisan deal that had one dollar…
BUSH: You find me…
HARWOOD: …one dollar of tax increases per ten
dollars of spending cuts, would you take it?
BUSH: You find me a Democrat — you find me a
Democrat that will cut spending ten dollars? Heck, find me a
Republican in Congress that would cut spending ten dollars. I’ll
talk to them.
HARWOOD: So you don’t want the coach to put
you in any more?
BUSH: Look, the — the deal is already done.
The biggest tax increase happened under the watch of Barack
Obama, and spending’s gone up. You find a Democrat that’s for
cutting taxes — cutting spending ten dollars, I’ll give them a
warm kiss.
(LAUGHTER)
HARWOOD: Thank you, governor.
Carl?
QUINTANILLA: Mrs. Fiorina, in 2010, while
running for Senate in Tech Ridge (ph), California, you called an
Internet sales tax a bad idea. Traditional brick and mortar
stores obviously disagree. Now that the Internet shopping
playing field has matured, what would be a fair plan to even
that playing field?
FIORINA: You know, I want to go back for a
moment to what we were just talking about. Crony capitalism is
alive and well, and has been so in Washington, D.C. for decades.
What’s crony capitalism? Crony capitalism is
what happens when government gets so big and so powerful that
only the big and the powerful can handle it.
So why are the pharmaceutical companies
consolidating? Why are there five even bigger Wall Street banks
now, instead of the ten we used to have on Wall Street? Because
when government gets big and powerful, the big feel like they
need to get even bigger to deal with all that power, and
meanwhile, the small and the powerless — in this case, 1,590
community banks — go out of business.
You see, folks, this is how socialism starts.
Government causes a problem, and then government steps in to
solve the problem. This is why, fundamentally, we have to take
our government back.
The student loan problem has been created by
government. Government trying to level the playing field between
Internet and brick-and-mortar creates a problem. The FCC jumping
in now and saying, “we’re going to put 400 pages of regulation
over the Internet,” is going to create massive problems.
But guess who pushed for that regulation? The
big Internet companies. This is what’s going on. Big and
powerful use big and powerful government to their advantage.
It’s why you see Walgreens buying Rite Aid.
It’s why you see the pharmaceuticals getting together. It’s you
see the health insurance companies getting together. It’s why
you see the banks consolidating.
And meanwhile, small businesses are getting
crushed. Community- based businesses and farms are getting
crushed. Community banks are going out of business. Big
government favors the big, the powerful, the wealthy and the
well-connected, and crushes the small and the powerless.
QUINTANILLA: Mrs. Fiorina.
FIORINA: It is why we have to simplify. It is
why we have to reduce the size and power of government.
QUINTANILLA: OK.
FIORINA: It’s the only way to level the
playing field between big and powerful and small and powerless.
QUINTANILLA: Thank you very much.
(APPLAUSE) QUICK: Senator Rubio, you yourself
have said that you’ve had issues. You have a lack of bookkeeping
skills. You accidentally inter-mingled campaign money with your
personal money. You faced (ph) foreclosure on a second home that
you bought. And just last year, you liquidated a $68,000
retirement fund. That’s something that cost you thousands of
dollars in taxes and penalties.
In terms of all of that, it raises the
question whether you have the maturity and wisdom to lead this
$17 trillion economy. What do you say?
RUBIO: Well, you just — you just listed a
litany of discredited attacks from Democrats and my political
opponents, and I’m not gonna waste 60 seconds detailing them
all. But I’m going to tell you the truth.
Here’s the truth. I didn’t inherit any money.
My dad was a bartender, my mother was a maid. They worked hard
to provide us the chance at a better life.
They didn’t save enough money for us to go to
school. I had to work my way through school. I had to borrow
money to go to school. I tried (ph), early in my marriage,
explaining to my wife why someone named Sallie Mae was taking
$1,000 out of our bank account every month.
(LAUGHTER)
I know what it’s like to owe that money, and
we’ve worked hard. We’ve worked hard our whole life to provide a
better family — a better life for our family.
We own a home four blocks away from the place
that I grew up in. My four children have been able to receive a
good Christian education, and I’ve been able to save for them to
go to college so they never have to have the loans that I did.
But I’m not worried about my finances, I’m
worried about the finances of everyday Americans who today are
struggling in an economy that is not producing good paying jobs
while everything else costs more. And that’s what this economy
needs to — that’s what this debate needs to be about.
This debate needs to be about the men and
women across this country that are struggling on a daily basis
to provide for their families the better future that we’ve
always said this country is all about.
QUICK: Senator, I understand all of that. I
had a lot of student loans when I got out, too. But you’ve had a
windfall that a lot of Americans haven’t. You made over a
million dollars on a book deal, and some of these problems came
after that.
RUBIO: And I used it to pay off my loans. And
it’s available on paperback, if you’re interested in buying my
book.
(APPLAUSE)
QUICK: But you — but you liquidated that
retirement account after the fact, and that cost you about
$24,000 out of that in taxes and feed. That — that was after
you’d already come into that windfall. That’s why I raised the
question.
RUBIO: Yeah, again, as I said, we’re raising a
family in the 21st century and it’s one of the reasons why my
tax plan is a pro- family tax plan.
It increases the per child tax credit, because
I didn’t read about this in a book. I know for a fact how
difficult it is to raise children, how expensive it’s become for
working families. And I make a lot more than the average
American. Imagine how hard it is for these people out there that
are making 40, 50, $60,000 a year, and they’re trying to provide
for their families at a time when this economy is not growing.
We can’t afford another four years of that.
Which is what we’re gonna get if we elect a big government
liberal like Hillary Clinton to the White House.
Thank you, senator.
HARWOOD: Governor John Kasich, you’ve called
for abolishing the Export Import Bank, which provides subsidies
to help American companies compete with overseas competitors.
You call that corporate welfare.
One of the largest newspapers in your state
wrote an editorial, said they found that strange, writing, that
if that’s corporate welfare, what does Kasich call the millions
of dollars in financial incentives doled out to attract or
retain jobs by his development effort — jobs Ohio.
If subsidies are good enough for Ohio
companies, why aren’t they good enough for companies trying to
compete overseas?
KASICH: Well, first of all, when we talk about
the Import Export Bank, it’s time to clean up corporate welfare.
If we’re gonna reform welfare for poor people, we ought to
reform it for rich people, as well. Secondly, in our state, we
went from a loss of 350,000 jobs to, now, a gain of 347,000 jobs
to the positive. Our wages are growing faster than the national
average, and I’ve cut taxes more than any sitting governor in
this state — $5 billion, including no taxes on small business
and killing the death tax.
I want to go back to what we were talking
about earlier, this budget deal in Washington.
This is the same old stuff since I left.
You spend the money today and then you hope
you’re going to save money tomorrow.
I don’t know if people understand, but I spent
a lifetime with my colleagues getting us to a federal balanced
budget. We actually did it. And I have a road map and a plan
right now to get us to balance.
Reforming entitlements, cutting taxes. You
see, because if you really want to get to a balanced budget, you
need to reduce your expenses and you need to grow your economy.
So what I will tell you about our incentives — our incentives
are tight, and at the end of the day we make sure that we gain
more from the creation of jobs than what we lose.
And you know what? Ohio, one of the best
growing places in the country — I not only did it in Washington,
I did it in Ohio, and I’ll go back to Washington, and there will
be no more silly deals…
HARWOOD: Thank you, Governor.
KASICH: … If I become President because we’ll
have a Constitutional Amendment to require a federally balanced
budget so they will do their job.
HARWOOD: Thank you, Governor. Thank you.
QUICK: Yes, thank you John.
Senator Cruz, working women in this country
still earn just 77 percent of what men earn. And I know that
you’ve said you’ve been very sympathetic to our cause. But
you’ve also you said that the Democrats’ moves to try and change
this are the political show votes.
I just wonder what you would do as President
to try and help in this cause?
CRUZ: Well, we’ve gotta turn the economy
around for people who are struggling.
The Democrats’ answer to everything is more
government control over wages, and more empowering trial lawyers
to file lawsuits.
You know, you look at women working. I’ll tell
you, in my family there are a lot of single moms in my family.
My sister was a single mom, both of my aunts who were a single
moms. My mom who’s here today, was a single mom when my father
left us when I was 3 years old.
Now, thank God, my father was invited to a
Bible study and became born again and he came back to my mom and
me and we were raised together. But I — the struggle of single
moms is extraordinary. And you know, when you see Hillary
Clinton and Bernie Sanders and all the Democrats talking about
wanting to address the plight of working women, not a one of
them mentioned the fact that under Barack Obama, 3.7 million
women have entered poverty.
Not a one of them mentioned the fact that
under Barack Obama and the big government economy, the median
wage for women has dropped $733. The the truth of the matter is,
big government benefits the wealthy, it benefits the lobbyists,
it benefits the giant corporations. And the people who are
getting hammered are small businesses, it’s single moms, it’s
Hispanics. That is who I’m fighting for. The people that
Washington leaves behind.
(CROSSTALK)
FIORINA: Becky, it is the height of hypocrisy
for Mrs. Clinton to talk about being the first woman President,
when every single policy she espouses, and every single policy
of President Obama has been demonstrably bad for women.
FIORINA: 92 percent — 92 percent of the jobs
lost during Barack Obama’s first term belonged to women. Senator
Cruz is precisely right. Three million women have fallen into
poverty under this administration. The number of women —
QUICK: Mrs. Fiorina —
FIORINA: — living in extreme poverty is the
highest level on record. I am a conservative because I know our
values, our principles and our policies —
QUICK: Mrs. Fiorina, we will come back to you.
FIORINA: — work better to lift everyone up,
men and women.
QUICK: Thank you, Mrs. Fiorina. Carl?
(APPLAUSE)
QUINTANILLA: Dr. Carson, we know you as a
physician, but we wanted to ask you about your involvement on
some corporate boards, including Costco’s. Last year, a
marketing study called the warehouse retailer the number one
gay-friendly brand in America, partly because of its domestic
partner benefits.
Why would you serve on a company whose
policies seem to run counter to your views on homosexuality?
CARSON: Well, obviously, you don’t understand
my views on homosexuality. I believe that our Constitution
protects everybody, regardless of their sexual orientation or
any other aspect. I also believe that marriage is between one
man and one woman. And there is no reason that you can’t be
perfectly fair to the gay community.
They shouldn’t automatically assume that
because you believe that marriage is between one man and one
woman that you are a homophobe. And this is one of the myths
that the left perpetrates on our society, and this is how they
frighten people and get people to shut up. You know, that’s what
the PC culture is all about, and it’s destroying this nation.
The fact of the matter is we the American
people are not each other’s enemies, it’s those people who are
trying to divide us who are the enemies. And we need to make
that very clear to everybody.
(APPLAUSE) QUINTANILLA: One more question.
This is a company called Mannatech, a maker of nutritional
supplements, with which you had a 10-year relationship. They
offered claims that they could cure autism, cancer, they paid $7
million to settle a deceptive marketing lawsuit in Texas, and
yet you’re involvement continued. Why?
CARSON: Well, that’s easy to answer. I didn’t
have an involvement with them. That is total propaganda, and
this is what happens in our society. Total propaganda.
I did a couple of speeches for them, I do
speeches for other people. They were paid speeches. It is
absolutely absurd to say that I had any kind of a relationship
with them.
Do I take the product? Yes. I think it’s a
good product.
QUINTANILLA: To be fair, you were on the
homepage of their website with the logo over your shoulder —
CARSON: If somebody put me on their homepage,
they did it without my permission.
QUINTANILLA: Does that not speak to your
vetting process or judgment in any way.
CARSON: No, it speaks to the fact that I don’t
know those —
(AUDIENCE BOOS)
See? They know.
(APPLAUSE)
QUINTANILLA: Apparently. We will take a break.
We’ll be back in Boulder in just a minute.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HARWOOD: Welcome back to the Republican
presidential debate on CNBC, live from Boulder, Colorado at the
University of Colorado.
Senator Huckabee, I mean — excuse me — Senator
Rubio, Wired magazine recently carried the heading, “Marco Rubio
wants to be the tech industry’s savior.” It noted your support
for dramatically increasing immigration visas called H1B, which
are designed for workers with the special skills that Silicon
Valley wants.
But your Senate colleague, Jeff Sessions of
Alabama, says in reality, the tech industry uses this program to
undercut hiring and wages for highly qualified Americans. Why is
he wrong?
RUBIO: Well, first of all, if a company gets
caught doing that, they should never be able to use the program
again. If you get caught abusing this program, you should never
be able to use it again.
The second thing I said is we need to add
reforms, not just increase the numbers, but add reforms. For
example, before you hire anyone from abroad, you should have to
advertise that job for 180 days. You also have to prove that
you’re going to pay these people more than you would pay someone
else, so that you’re not undercutting it by bringing in cheap
labor.
But here’s the best solution of all. We need
to get back to training people in this country to do the jobs of
the 21st century. Why, for the life of me, I do not understand
why did we stop doing vocational education in America, people
that can work with their hands; people you can train to do this
work while they’re still in high school so they can graduate
ready to go work. But the best way to close this gap is to
modernize higher education so Americans have the skills for
those jobs. But in the interim, in the absence of that, what’s
happening is some of these tech companies are taking those —
those centers (ph) to Canada because they can get people to go
over there instead of here.
But the ideal scenario is to train Americans
to do the work so we don’t have to rely on people from abroad.
HARWOOD: It sounds like you think Senator
Sessions is wrong to believe there is enough abuse in that
program that we shouldn’t…
(CROSSTALK)
RUBIO: Well, I believe that there are abuses,
those companies should be permanently barred from ever using the
program again and we should put strict standards in place to
ensure that they’re not being abused, like the prevailing wage
requirement and like the advertising requirement.
HARWOOD: Thank you, Senator.
Becky?
QUICK: Mr. Trump, let’s stay on this issue of
immigration. You have been very critical of Mark Zuckerberg of
Facebook who has wanted to increase the number of these H1Bs.
TRUMP: I was not at all critical of him. I was
not at all. In fact, frankly, he’s complaining about the fact
that we’re losing some of the most talented people. They go to
Harvard. They go to Yale. They go to Princeton. They come from
another country and they’re immediately sent out.
I am all in favor of keeping these talented
people here so they can go to work in Silicon Valley.
QUICK: So you’re in favor of…
(CROSSTALK)
TRUMP: So I have nothing at all critical of
him.
‘ QUICK: Where did I read this and come up
with this that you were…
(CROSSTALK)
TRUMP: Probably, I don’t know — you people
write the stuff. I don’t know where you…
(LAUGHTER)
(APPLAUSE)
TRUMP: And if I could say just one thing. I am
the only person in either campaign that’s self-funding. I’m
putting up 100 percent of my own money. And right now, I will be
putting up a tremendous — so far, I’ve put up less than anybody
and I have the best results. Wouldn’t that be nice if the
country could do that?
But I will be putting — I will be putting up,
you know, tremendous amounts of money. SuperPacs are a disaster.
They’re a scam. They cause dishonesty. And you better get rid of
them because they are causing a lot of bad decisions to be made
by some very good people. And I’m not blaming these folks —
well, I guess I could.
(LAUGHTER)
Very good people are making very bad decisions
right now. And if anything comes out of this whole thing with
some of these nasty and ridiculous questions, I will tell you,
you better get rid of the SuperPacs because they causing a big
problem with this country, not only in dishonesty and what’s
going on, but also in a lot of bad decisions that have been made
for the benefit of lobbyists and special interests.
QUICK: You know, Mr. — you know, Mr. Trump, if
I may (inaudible). You’ve been — you have been — you had talked
a little bit about Marco Rubio. I think you called him Mark
Zuckerberg’s personal senator because he was in favor of the
H1B.
TRUMP: I never said that. I never said that.
QUICK: So this was an erroneous article the
whole way around?
TRUMP: You’ve got another gentleman in
Florida, who happens to be a very nice guy, but not…
QUICK: My apologies. I’m sorry.
(CROSSTALK)
TRUMP: … he’s really doing some bad…
(CROSSTALK)
RUBIO: Since I’ve been mentioned, can I
respond?
(CROSSTALK)
QUICK: Yes, you can.
RUBIO: OK. I know the Democrats have the
ultimate SuperPac. It’s called the mainstream media who every
single day…
(APPLAUSE)
… and I’ll tell you why. Last week, Hillary
Clinton went before a committee. She admitted she had sent
e-mails to her family saying, “Hey, this attack at Benghazi was
caused by Al Qaida-like elements.” She spent over a week telling
the families of those victims and the American people that it
was because of a video. And yet the mainstream media is going
around saying it was the greatest week in Hillary Clinton’s
campaign.
It was the week she got exposed as a liar. It
was the week that she got exposed as a liar…
(APPLAUSE)
But she has her super PAC helping her out, the
American mainstream media.
QUICK: Senator Rubio, thank you very much.
I would like to introduce my colleague, Rick
Santelli, he has some comments as well, sir.
SANTELLI: Senator Cruz, let’s focus on our
central bank, the Federal Reserve. You’ve been a fierce critic
of the Fed, arguing for more transparency. Where do you want to
take that?
Do you want to get Congress involved in
monetary policy, or is it time to slap the Fed back and downsize
them completely? What are your thoughts? What do you believe?
CRUZ: Well, Rick, it’s a very important
question. I have got deep concerns about the Fed. The first
thing I think we need to do is audit the Fed. And I am an
original co-sponsor of Rand Paul’s audit the Fed legislation.
The second thing we need to do is I think we
need to bring together a bipartisan commission to look at
getting back to rules- based monetary policy, end this star
chamber that has been engaging in this incredible experiment of
quantitative easing, QE1, QE2, QE3, QE- infinity.
And the people who are being impacted, you
know, a question that was asked earlier, Becky asked, was about
working women. You know, it’s interesting, you look at on Wall
Street, the Fed is doing great. It’s driving up stock prices.
Wall Street is doing great.
You know, today, the top 1 percent earn a
higher share of our income than any year since 1928. But if you
look at working men and women. If you look at a single mom
buying groceries, she sees hamburger prices have gone up nearly
40 percent.
She sees her cost of electricity going up. She
sees her health insurance going up. And loose money is one of
the major problems. We need sound money. And I think the Fed
should get out of the business of trying to juice our economy
and simply be focused on sound money and monetary stability,
ideally tied to gold.
SANTELLI: Senator Paul, the same question to
you.
PAUL: Well, thank you very much. I would like
to thank Ted for co-sponsoring my bill, audit the Fed. And I
think it’s precisely because of the arrogance of someone like
Ben Bernanke, who now calls us all know-nothings, that is
precisely why we need audit the Fed.
I think it is really very much a huge problem
that an organization as powerful as the Fed comes in, lobbies
against them being audited on the Hill. I would prevent them
lobbying Congress. I don’t think the Fed should be involved with
lobbying us.
I think we should examine how the Fed has
really been part of the problem. You want to study income
inequality, let’s bring the Fed forward and talk about Fed
policy and how it causes income inequality.
Let’s also bring the Fed forward and have them
explain how they caused the housing boom and the crisis, and
what they’ve done to make us better or worse. I think the Fed
has been a great problem in our society.
What you need to do is free up interest rates.
Interest rates are the price of money, and we shouldn’t have
price controls on the price of money.
SANTELLI: Thank you, Senator.
(APPLAUSE)
Dr. Carson, you told The Des Moines Register
that you don’t like government subsidies, it interferes with the
free market. But you’ve also said that you’re in favor of taking
oil subsidies and putting them towards ethanol processing.
Isn’t that just swapping one subsidy for
another, Doctor?
CARSON: Well, first of all, I was wrong about
taking the oil subsidy. I have…
… the best results, wouldn’t that be nice if
the country could do that?
But I will be putting — I will be putting up,
you know, tremendous amounts of money. Super PACs are a
disaster. They’re a scam. They cause dishonesty. And you had
better get rid of them, because they are causing a lot of bad
decisions to be made by some very good people.
And I’m not blaming these folks — but I guess
I could.
(LAUGHTER)
Very good people are making very bad decisions
right now. And if anything comes out of this whole thing with
some of these nasty and ridiculous questions, I will tell you,
you had better get rid of the super PACs, because they’re
causing a big problem with this country, not only in dishonesty
and what’s going on, but also in a lot of bad decisions that are
being made for the benefit of lobbyists and special interests.
(CROSSTALK)
QUICK: You know, Mr. Trump, if I may…
(CROSSTALK)
QUICK: Just a minute, Ms. Fiorina, let me
follow up on this for just a moment.
You talked a little bit about Marco Rubio. I
think you called him “Mark Zuckerberg’s personal senator”
because he was in favor H- 1B…
(CROSSTALK)
TRUMP: I never said that. I never said that.
QUICK: So this was an erroneous article the
whole way around?
TRUMP: He has got another gentleman in
Florida, who happens to be a very nice guy, but not…
QUICK: My apologies. I’m sorry…
(CROSSTALK)
TRUMP: Everybody is really doing some bad
fact…
RUBIO: Since I’ve been mentioned, can I
respond?
QUICK: Yes. Yes, you may.
RUBIO: OK. You know, the Democrats who have
the ultimate super PAC, it’s called the mainstream media.
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
And I’ll tell you why, last week, Hillary
Clinton went before a committee, she admitted she had sent
emails to her family saying, hey, this attack in Benghazi was
caused by al Qaeda-like elements.
She spent over a week telling the families of
those victims and the American people that it was because of a
video. And yet the mainstream media is going around saying it
was the greatest week in Hillary Clinton’s campaign.
It was the week she got exposed as a liar. It
was the week that she got exposed as a liar…
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
But she has her super PAC helping her out, the
American mainstream media.
QUICK: Senator Rubio, thank you very much.
I would like to introduce my colleague, Rick
Santelli, he has some comments as well, sir.
SANTELLI: Senator Cruz, let’s focus on our
central bank, the Federal Reserve. You’ve been a fierce critic
of the Fed, arguing for more transparency. Where do you want to
take that?
Do you want to get Congress involved in
monetary policy, or is it time to slap the Fed back and downsize
them completely? What are your thoughts? What do you believe?
CRUZ: Well, Rick, it’s a very important
question. I have got deep concerns about the Fed. The first
thing I think we need to do is audit the Fed. And I am an
original co-sponsor of Rand Paul’s audit the Fed legislation.
The second thing we need to do is I think we
need to bring together a bipartisan commission to look at
getting back to rules- based monetary policy, end this star
chamber that has been engaging in this incredible experiment of
quantitative easing, QE1, QE2, QE3, QE- infinity.
And the people who are being impacted, you
know, a question that was asked earlier, Becky asked, was about
working women. You know, it’s interesting, you look at on Wall
Street, the Fed is doing great. It’s driving up stock prices.
Wall Street is doing great.
You know, today, the top 1 percent earn a
higher share of our income than any year since 1928. But if you
look at working men and women. If you look at a single mom
buying groceries, she sees hamburger prices have gone up nearly
40 percent.
She sees her cost of electricity going up. She
sees her health insurance going up. And loose money is one of
the major problems. We need sound money. And I think the Fed
should get out of the business of trying to juice our economy
and simply be focused on sound money and monetary stability,
ideally tied to gold.
SANTELLI: Senator Paul, the same question to
you.
PAUL: Well, thank you very much. I would like
to thank Ted for co-sponsoring my bill, audit the Fed. And I
think it’s precisely because of the arrogance of someone like
Ben Bernanke, who now calls us all know-nothings, that is
precisely why we need audit the Fed.
I think it is really very much a huge problem
that an organization as powerful as the Fed comes in, lobbies
against them being audited on the Hill. I would prevent them
lobbying Congress. I don’t think the Fed should be involved with
lobbying us.
I think we should examine how the Fed has
really been part of the problem. You want to study income
inequality, let’s bring the Fed forward and talk about Fed
policy and how it causes income inequality.
Let’s also bring the Fed forward and have them
explain how they caused the housing boom and the crisis, and
what they’ve done to make us better or worse. I think the Fed
has been a great problem in our society.
What you need to do is free up interest rates.
Interest rates are the price of money, and we shouldn’t have
price controls on the price of money.
SANTELLI: Thank you, Senator.
(APPLAUSE)
Dr. Carson, you told The Des Moines Register
that you don’t like government subsidies, it interferes with the
free market. But you’ve also said that you’re in favor of taking
oil subsidies and putting them towards ethanol processing.
Isn’t that just swapping one subsidy for
another, Doctor?
CARSON: Well, first of all, I was wrong about
taking the oil subsidy. I have studied that issue in great
detail. And what I have concluded is that the best policy is to
get rid of all government subsidies, and get the government out
of our lives, and let people rise and fall based on how good
they are.
And — you know, all of this too big to fail
stuff and picking and choosing winners and losers — this is a
bunch of crap, and it is really causing a great deal of — great
deal of problems for our society right now.
And — and — you know, it goes back to the
whole concept of regulations, which are in everything. The
reason that I — I hate them so much is because every single
regulation costs in terms of goods and services.
That cost gets passed on to the people. Now,
who are the people who are hurt by that? It’s poor people and
middle class. Doesn’t hurt rich people if their bar of soap goes
up ten cents, but it hurts the poor and the middle class.
And Bernie Sanders will tell them that it’s
because of the rich. Well, I’ll tell you something: you can take
everything from the top 1 percent, and you apply it to our
fiscal gap, and you won’t even make a dent in it.
SANTELLI: Thank you, Doctor.
Becky?
QUICK: Rick, thank you very much.
Governor Huckabee, you have railed against
income inequality. You’ve said that some Wall Street executives
should have gone to jail over the roles that they played during
the financial crisis.
Apart from your tax plan, are there specific
steps you would require from corporate America to try and reduce
the income inequality.
HUCKABEE: I don’t think it’s so much about
when the government orders a corporation to do something. In
fact, that’s part of the problem. If you saw that blimp that got
cut loose from Maryland today, it’s a perfect example of
government.
I mean, what we had was something the
government made — basically a bag of gas — that cut loose,
destroyed everything in its path, left thousands of people
powerless, but they couldn’t get rid of it because we had too
much money invested in it, so we had to keep it.
That is our government today. We saw it in the
blimp.
(APPLAUSE)
That’s exactly what we saw. So look,
corporations ought to exercise some responsibility. When CEO
income has risen 90 percent above the average worker, when the
bottom 90 percent of this country’s economy has had stagnant
wages for the past 40 years, somebody is taking it in the teeth.
And it’s not the folks on Wall Street. I’m not
anti-Wall Street, but I don’t believe the government ought to
wear a team jersey, pick winners and losers.
QUICK: Governor?
HUCKABEE: The government ought to wear a
striped shirt and just make sure the game…
QUICK: Governor?
HUCKABEE: …is paid — played fairly.
QUICK: Thank you. Now, everybody else has
fudged their time and gone over, so please, don’t cut me off too
quick, Becky.
QUICK: All right, Governor Huckabee.
HUCKABEE: Let me just close it out this way.
QUICK: How about 15 more seconds?
HUCKABEE: We need to be focusing on what fixes
this country. And I’ll tell you one thing that we never talk
about — we haven’t talked about it tonight.
Why aren’t we talking about — instead of
cutting benefits for old people, cutting benefits for sick
people — why don’t we say, “let’s cure the four big cost-driving
diseases…
QUICK: Governor?
HUCKABEE: …”diabetes, heart disease, cancer
and Alzheimer’s?”
QUICK: Governor, I’m sorry…
HUCKABEE: If you do that, you don’t just
change the economy, you transform the lives of millions of
hurting Americans.
QUICK: Governor, thank you.
HUCKABEE: Gosh, I’d love for us to talk about
something like that. Thank you. QUICK: Governor, thank you.
Appreciate it.
John?
HARWOOD: Governor Bush, the tax reform bill
that Ronald Reagan signed in 1986 cut the top personal income
tax rate to 28 percent — just like your plan does. But President
Reagan taxed capital gains at the same rate, while you would tax
them at just 20 percent.
Given the problems we’ve been discussing,
growing gap between rich and poor, why would you tax labor at a
higher rate than income from investments?
BUSH: Look, the — the simple fact is that my
plan actually gives the middle class the greatest break: $2,000
per family. And if you make $40,000 a year, a family of four,
you don’t pay any income tax at all.
Simplifying the code and lowering rates, both
for corporations and — and personal rates, is exactly what we
need to do. You think about the regulatory cost and the tax cost
— that’s why small businesses are closing, rather than being
formed in our country right now.
The big corporations have the scale to deal
with all of this. And what I think all of us are saying is, our
monetary policy, our tax policy, regulatory policy needs to be
radically changed so we can create high sustained growth for
income to rise.
The government has tried it their way. Under —
under Barack Obama and the proposals of Hillary Clinton and
Bernie Sanders and others, they’ve tried it their way, and it
has failed miserably.
We need to take a new approach of taxing —
reforming how we tax, and reforming the regulations in our — in
our country before it’s too late.
HARWOOD: Senator Rubio, 30 seconds to you.
The Tax Foundation, which was alluded to
earlier, scored your tax plan and concluded that you give nearly
twice as much of a gain in after-tax income to the top 1 percent
as to people in the middle of the income scale.
Since you’re the champion of Americans living
paycheck-to- paycheck, don’t you have that backward?
RUBIO: No, that’s — you’re wrong. In fact, the
largest after- tax gains is for the people at the lower end of
the tax spectrum under my plan. And there’s a bunch of things my
tax plan does to help them.
Number one, you have people in this country
that…
HARWOOD: The Tax Foundation — just to be
clear, they said the…
(CROSSTALK)
RUBIO: …you wrote a story on it, and you had
to go back and correct it.
HARWOOD: No, I did not.
RUBIO: You did. No, you did.
(APPLAUSE)
(CROSSTALK)
HARWOOD: Senator, the Tax Foundation said
after-tax income for the top 1 percent under your plan would go
up 27.9 percent.
RUBIO: Well, you’re talking about — yeah.
HARWOOD: And people in the middle of the
income spectrum, about 15 percent.
RUBIO: Yeah, but that — because the math is,
if you — 5 percent of a million is a lot more than 5 percent of
a thousand. So yeah, someone who makes more money…
HARWOOD: (inaudible)
RUBIO: …numerically, it’s gonna be higher. But
the greatest gains, percentage-wise, for people, are gonna be at
the lower end of our plan, and here’s why: because in addition
to a general personal exemption, we are increasing the per-child
tax credit for working families.
We are lowering taxes on small business. You
know, a lot of business activity in America is conducted like
the guy that does my dry cleaning. He’s an S corporation. He
pays on his personal rate, and he is paying higher than the big
dry-cleaning chain down the street, because he’s paying at his
personal rate.
RUBIO: Under my plan, no business, big or
small, will pay more than 25 percent flat rate on their business
income. That is a dramatic tax decrease for hard-working people
who run their own businesses.
(CROSSTALK)
RUBIO: …The other thing I’d like to make about
our plan, one more point, it is the most pro growth tax plan
that I can imagine because it doesn’t tax investments at all.
You know why? Because the more you tax something, the less of it
you get.
I want to be in — I want America to be the
best…
PAUL: …John…
RUBIO: …in the world for people…
HARWOOD: Senator, thank you.
PAUL: John, I’d like to address this? John,
could I follow up on this?
QUINTANILLA: …We’ll come back around. I want
to get to governor Kasich.
PAUL: What are the rules on who gets to follow
up. How do we decide on who gets to follow up? I’ve seen plenty
of other people follow up?
QUICK: It’s at the moderator discretion.
QUINTANILLA: Governor Kasich, let’s talk …
(CROSSTALK)
QUINTANILLA: …about Marijuana, Governor
Kasich…
PAUL: I’d like to just mention something about
my tax plan, and how it relates to the discussion…
QUINTANILLA: Alright, but 30 seconds, you made
a case. Sure, 30 seconds.
PAUL: Alright. Much of the discussion is
centered over whether or not the different tax plans help, or
affect the middle class. In fact, it’s the chief argument by
democrats against many of the different flat tax proposals. Mine
is unique in the sense that my tax plan actually gets rid of the
payroll tax as well. It shifts it to the business, and it would
allow middle class people to get a tax cut.
If you just cut their income tax, there isn’t
much income tax to cut. Mine actually cuts the payroll tax, and
I think it would spread the tax cut across all socioeconomic
levels, and would allow then it to be something that would be
broadly supported by the public in an election.
QUINTANILLA: Senator, thank you.
CRUZ: Let me say on that…
QUINTANILLA: Oh, no, no, no…
CRUZ: …Rand is exactly right. His plan is a
good plan, and I will note that my 10% plan also eliminates the
payroll tax, eliminates the death tax,
QUINTANILLA: …Ok…
CRUZ: …eliminates the business…
MALE: (INAUDIBLE)
CRUZ: …income tax…
MALE: What are you doing?
CRUZ: …10% flat rate…
QUINTANILLA: …We’re going to go to…
CRUZ: …is the lowest personal rate any
candidate up here has, and what it would also enable us to do is
for every citizen to fill out their taxes on a postcard so we
can eliminate the IRS.
(CHEERING) (APPLAUSE)
QUINTANILLA: OK. Thank you, Senator. Governor
Kasich, let’s talk about marijuana. We’re broadcasting from
Colorado which has seen $150 million in new revenue for the
state since legalizing last year. Governor Hickenlooper is not a
big fan of legalization, but he’s said the people who used to be
smoking it are still smoking it, they’re just now paying taxes.
Given the budget pressures in Ohio, and other
states, is this a revenue stream you’d like to have?
KASICH: Well, first of all, we’re running a $2
billion dollar surplus, we’re not having a revenue problem right
now. And, sending mixed signals to kids about drugs is a
disaster. Drugs is one of the greatest scourge in this country,
and I spent five years of my administration working with my team
to do a whole sort of things to try to reign in the problem of
overdoses, and it goes on and on. We could do a whole show on
that.
I want to go back for a second thought on this
issue of income inequality. My program would move the 104
programs of the federal Department of Education into four block
grants, and send them back to the states because income
inequality is driven by a lack of skills when kids don’t get
what they need to be able to compete and win in this country.
The fact is, in order to get this economy
moving again, I call for freezing regulations for a year except
for the problem of public safety. I believe that we need to cut
these taxes down, we need to be on a roadmap to balancing the
budget, and we need to send power, money, and influence, the
welfare department, the education department, job training,
infrastructure, Medicaid, all of that out of Washington back to
the states so we can run these programs from where we live to
the top, not a one size fits all mentality that they have in
Washington.
And, that will get to the nub of opportunity
for our children, and an ability to see wages rise. Again…
(CROSSTALK)
KASICH: …One more time, in Ohio, our wages are
growing faster than the national average. We’ve cut taxes,
balanced budgets, changed the regulatory environment. Folks, you
want to —
QUINTANILLA: Thank you, Governor.
KASICH: — fix America, this is the formula. It
worked for Reagan and it works for our team in Ohio. Thank you.
QUINTANILLA: Thank you. We’ll be back from
Boulder, Colorado in just a moment.
(APPLAUSE)
(BREAK)
QUICK: Welcome back to the University of
Colorado and the Republican presidential debate right here on
CNBC.
Mr. Trump, I want to go back to an issue that
we were talking about before, the H-1B visas. I found where I
read that before. It was from the donaldjtrump.com website and
it says — it says that again, Mark Zuckerburg’s personal
senator, Marco Rubio has a bill to triple H-1Bs that would
decimate women and minorities. Are you in favor of H-1Bs or are
you opposed to them?
TRUMP: I’m in favor of people coming into this
country legally. And you know what? They can have it anyway you
want. You can call it visas, you can call it work permits, you
can call it anything you want. I’ve created tens of thousands of
jobs, and in all due respect — and actually some of these folks
I really like a lot — but I’m the only one that can say that. I
have created tens of thousands of jobs, and I’ll be creating
many millions of jobs if I’m given — if I’m given the
opportunity to be president.
As far as Mark is concerned, as far as the
visas are concerned, if we need people, they have — it’s fine.
They have to come into this country legally. We have a country
of borders. We have a country of laws. We have to obey the laws.
It’s fine if they come in, but they have to come in legally.
QUICK: Thank you, sir.
RUBIO: I was mentioned in the question.
QUICK: You were. You get 30 seconds.
RUBIO: Thank you.
Well, I’ve learned the rules on this.
(LAUGHTER)
Look, in addition to what Donald was saying is
we also need to talk about the legal immigration system for
permanent residents. Today, we have a legal immigration system
for permanent residency that is largely based on whether or not
you have a relative living here. And that’s the way my parents
came legally in 1956.
But in 2015, we have a very different economy.
Our legal immigration system from now on has to be merit-based.
It has to be based on what skills you have, what you can
contribute economically, and most important of all, on whether
or not you’re coming here to become an American, not just live
in America, but be an American.
QUICK: Thank you, Senator. Thank you, Senator.
Carl?
QUINTANILLA: Mr. Trump, you’ve said you have a
special permit to carry a gun in New York.
TRUMP: Yes.
QUINTANILLA: After the Oregon mass shooting on
October 1st, you said, “By the way, it was a gun-free zone. If
you had a couple of teachers with guns, you would have been a
hell of a lot better off.”
TRUMP: Or somebody else. Right.
QUINTANILLA: Would you feel more comfortable
if your employees brought guns to work?
TRUMP: Yes, I might feel more comfortable. I
would say that I would and I have a permit, which is very
unusual in New York — a permit to carry. And I do carry on
occasion, sometimes a lot. But I like to be unpredictable so
that people don’t know exactly… (LAUGHTER)
QUINTANILLA: Are you carrying one now?
(LAUGHTER)
(CROSSTALK)
TRUMP: By the way, unlike our country where
we’re totally predictable and the enemy, whether it’s ISIS or
anybody else, they know exactly what we’re doing because we have
the wrong leadership.
(APPLAUSE)
But I feel that the gun-free zones and, you
know, when you say that, that’s target practice for the sickos
and for the mentally ill. That’s target. They look around for
gun-free zones. You know, we could give you another example —
the Marines, the Army, these wonderful six soldiers that were
killed. Two of them were among the most highly decorated — they
weren’t allowed on a military base to have guns. And somebody
walked in and shot them, killed them. If they had guns, he
wouldn’t be around very long. I can tell you, there wouldn’t
have been much damage.
So, I think gun-free zones are a catastrophe.
They’re a feeding frenzy for sick people.
QUINTANILLA: We called a few Trump resorts, a
few Trump properties that — that do not allow guns with or
without a permit. Would you change those policies?
TRUMP: I would change them. I would change
them.
QUINTANILLA: OK. All right. Thank you.
John?
HARWOOD: Governor Huckabee, you’ve written
about the huge divide in values between middle America and the
big coastal cities like New York and Los Angeles. As a preacher
as well as a politician, you know that presidents need the moral
authority to bring the entire country together.
The leading Republican candidate, when you
look at the average of national polls right now, is Donald
Trump. When you look at him, do you see someone with the moral
authority to unite the country?
HUCKABEE: You know, of the few questions I’ve
got, the last one I need is to give him some more time. I love
Donald Trump. He is a good man. I’m wearing a Trump tie tonight.
Get over that one, OK?
(APPLAUSE)
(CROSSTALK)
(UNKNOWN): Is it made in Mexico? HUCKABEE: I
don’t know.
(UNKNOWN): Where’s it made? Is it made in
China?
(UNKNOWN): Is it made in China or Mexico?
HUCKABEE: I have no idea.
(CROSSTALK)
TRUMP: Such a nasty — such a nasty question,
but thank you, Governor.
HUCKABEE: You’re welcome.
(LAUGHTER)
Let me tell you, Donald Trump would be a
president every day of the week and twice on Sunday, rather than
Hillary. I’ve spent a lifetime in politics fighting the Clinton
machine.
(APPLAUSE)
You want to talk about what we’re going to be
up against next year? I’m the only guy on this stage — you know,
everybody has an “only guy” — “I’m the only guy this; I’m the
only guy that.” Well, let me tell you one thing that I am the
only guy: The only guy that has consistently fought the Clinton
machine every election I was ever in over the past 26 years. And
not only did I fight them, but I beat them.
Somebody says “I’m a fighter.” Well, I want to
know, did you win? Well, I did. And not only did I fight them
and win, I lived to tell about it and I’m standing on this stage
tonight as evidence of that. And I think that ought to be worth
something.
HARWOOD: Thank you, Governor.
CHRISTIE: John, I’ll tell you something. You
want to talk about moral authority. Let’s talk about something
that happened this week in the news. You know, the FBI director,
the president’s appointed FBI director has said this week that
because of a lack of support from politicians like the president
of the United States, that police officers are afraid to get out
of their cars; that they’re afraid to enforce the law. And he
says, the president’s appointee, that crime is going up because
of this.
And when the president of the United States
gets out to speak about it, does he support police officers?
Does he stand up for law enforcement? No, he doesn’t. I’ll tell
you this, the number one job of the president of the United
States is to protect the safety and security of the American
people. This president has failed, and when I’m in the Oval
Office, police officers will know that they will have the
support of the president of the Untied States. That’s real moral
authority that we need in the Oval Office.
HARWOOD: Thank you, Governor.
Don’t forget my colleague, Sharon Epperson.
EPPERSON: Thank you, John.
Mrs. Fiorina, you were the CEO of a large
corporation that offers a 401(k) to its employees. But more than
half of American have no access to an employer sponsored
retirement plan.
That includes the workers at small businesses,
and the growing ranks of Uber drivers and other part-timers in
the freelance economy.
Should the Federal Government play a larger
role in helping to set up retirement plans for these workers?
FIORINA: No, the Federal Government should not
play a larger role.
Look, every time the Federal Government gets
engaged in something it gets worse. And then the Government
steps in to try and solve the problem and we get a little
further down to that progressive vision that Hillary Clinton is
talking about.
Companies should, if they want to attract the
best workers, provide a good set of benefits. But honestly, if
you’re a small business owner today you are being crushed. We
have 400,000 small businesses forming every year in this
country. How great is that? They are employing themselves, they
are potentially employing others.
The bad news is, we have 470,000 going out of
business every year. And why? They cite Obamacare.
They are refusing to…
EPPERSON: So you wouldn’t agree — you wouldn’t
agree with a start for 401(k) for businesses or anything like
that?
FIORINA: I think it’s a wonderful that that
businesses start a 401(k). The point I’m making is this, the
Federal Government should not be in a lot of things.
There is no Constitutional role for the
Federal Government in setting up — retirement plans. There is no
Constitutional role for the Federal Government to be setting
minimum wages…
EPPERSON: Thank you very much.
FIORINA: … The more the Government gets
engaged in the economy, the slower the economy becomes. The more
the Government gets engaged in the economy, it is demonstrably
true…
EPPERSON: Thank you, the rules say one minute.
FIORINA: … The more the big, the powerful, the
wealthy and the well-connected are advantaged.
EPPERSON: Thank you, Ms. Fiorina. We
appreciate it. Thank you, thank you.
I want to turn my attention now, to you now,
Governor Kasich.
Most people can’t get a college degree without
going into debt. Over 40 million Americans have student loans
and many of them cannot pay them back.
This country has over $100 billion in student
loan defaults. That’s billion with a b.
What will you do to make sure that students,
their families, taxpayers, won’t feel the economic impact of
this burden for generations?
Well, first of all, in Ohio we’re changing the
whole system. Universities will not get paid one dime unless the
student graduates or — graduates or completes a course.
Secondly, you can be in high school and
complete almost an entire first year before you go to college
and get credit to do that. And, of course, in addition to that,
we are working now to go after the cost drivers in our
universities. And let me give you an example. Universities today
have so many non-academic assets. At Ohio State they sold the
parking garage and the parking lot, and they got $500 million
because they shouldn’t be in the parking lot business. They
shouldn’t be in the ding business, they shouldn’t be in the dorm
business.
And, of course, we need to take advantage of
on-line education to reduce these costs and begin to
dis-intermediate the cost of four years.
Now, for those who that have these big high
costs, I think we can seriously look at an idea of where you can
do public service. I mean legitimate, public service and begin
to pay off some of that debt through the public service that you
do. And in the meantime, it may inspire us to care more about
our country, more about ourselves.
This is a big moral issue in America. Living a
life bigger than yourself, and being a center of healing and
justice. And people can learn it through public service.
EPPERSON: Thank you, thank you.
BUSH: We don’t need the federal government to
be involved in this at all.
QUICK: Higher education is the example…
BUSH: We don’t need the Federal Government to
be involved in this, because when they do we create a $1.2
trillion debt.
In Florida, we have the lowest in-state
tuition of any state, because there’s accountability, just as
John said. Let the states do this. You’ll create a much better
graduation rate at a lower cost, and you won’t in debt the next
generation with recourse debt on their backs.
It’s always a solution of the left to create
more Government from the Federal Government. It is broke, it is
not working.
(CROSSTALK)
QUINTANILLA: Governor Bush, daily fantasy
sports has become a phenomenon in this country, will award
billions of dollars in prize money this year. But to play you
have to assess your odds, put money at risk, wait for an outcome
that’s out of your control. Isn’t that the definition of
gambling, and should the Federal Government treat it as such?
BUSH: Well, first of all, I’m 7 and 0 in my
fantasy league.
QUINTANILLA: I had a feeling you were going to
brag about that.
BUSH: Gronkowski is still going strong. I have
Ryan Tannehill, Marco, as my quarterback, he was 18 for 19 last
week. So I’m doing great. But we’re not gambling.
And I think this has become something that
needs to be looked at in terms of regulation. Effectively it is
day trading without any regulation at all. And when you have
insider information, which apparently has been the case, where
people use that information and use big data to try to take
advantage of it, there has to be some regulation.
If they can’t regulate themselves, then the
NFL needs to look at just, you know, moving away from them a
little bit. And there should be some regulation. I have no clue
whether the federal government is the proper place, my instinct
is to say, hell no, just about everything about the federal
government.
(CROSSTALK)
CHRISTIE: Carl, are we really talking about
getting government involved in fantasy football?
(LAUGHTER)
We have — wait a second, we have $19 trillion
in debt. We have people out of work. We have ISIS and al Qaeda
attacking us. And we’re talking about fantasy football? Can we
stop?
(APPLAUSE)
CHRISTIE: How about this? How about we get the
government to do what they’re supposed to be doing, secure our
borders, protect our people, and support American values and
American families. Enough on fantasy football. Let people play,
who cares?
(CROSSTALK)
QUICK: I want to go back, if I can, to the
issue of…
(CROSSTALK)
QUICK: I want to go back, if I may, to the…
HARWOOD: Governor Christie, you’ve said something that many in
your party do not believe, which is that climate change is
undeniable, that human activity contributes to it, and you said,
quote: “The question is, what do we do to deal with it?”.
So what do we do?
CHRISTIE: Well, first off, what we don’t do is
do what Hillary Clinton and John Kerry and Barack Obama want us
to do, which is their solution for everything, put more taxes on
it, give more money to Washington, D.C., and then they will fix
it.
Well, there is no evidence that they can fix
anything in Washington, D.C.
HARWOOD: What should we do?
CHRISTIE: What we should do is to be investing
in all types of energy, John, all types of energy. I’ve laid
out…
HARWOOD: You mean government?
CHRISTIE: No, John. John, do you want me to
answer or do you want to answer?
(LAUGHTER)
How are we going to do this?
(APPLAUSE)
Because, I’ve got to tell you the truth, even
in New Jersey what you’re doing is called rude. So…
(LAUGHTER)
We’ve laid out a national energy plan that
says that we should invest in all types of energy. I will tell
you, you could win a bet at a bar tonight, since we’re talking
about fantasy football, if you ask who the top three states in
America are that produce solar energy: California and Arizona
are easy, but number three is New Jersey.
Why? Because we work with the private sector
to make solar energy affordable and available to businesses and
individuals in our state.
We need to make sure that we do everything
across all kinds of energy: natural gas, oil, absolutely. But
also where it’s affordable, solar, wind in Iowa has become very
affordable and it makes sense.
That is the way we deal with global warming,
climate change, or any of those problems, not through government
intervention, not through government taxes, and for God’s sake,
don’t send Washington another dime until they stop wasting the
money they’re already sending there.
HARWOOD: Thank you, Governor.
(APPLAUSE)
HARWOOD: Becky.
QUICK: Senator Paul, among the leading
conservative opponents to the creation of Medicare back in the
1960s was Ronald Reagan. He warned that it would lead to
socialism. Considering the mounting cost of Medicare, was he
right to oppose it?
PAUL: The question always is, what works
better, the private marketplace or government? And what
distributes goods better? It always seems to be the private
marketplace does a better job.
Is there an area for a safety net? Can you
have Medicare or Social Security? Yes. But you ought to
acknowledge the government doesn’t do a very good job at it.
The main problem with Medicare right now is
that the average person pays in taxes over their whole lifetime
about $100,000. But the average person takes out about $350,000.
We have this enormous mismatch because we have smaller and
smaller families.
When people ask me, whose fault is it? Whose
fault is it that Medicare is broken, out of money, that Social
Security is broken, out of money? And I say, look, it’s not
Republicans’ fault, it’s not Democrats’ fault, it’s your
grandparents’ fault for having too many damn kids.
(LAUGHTER)
After the war we had all of these kids, Baby
Boomers. Now we’re having smaller families. We used to have 16
workers for one retiree, now you have three workers for one
retiree.
It’s not working. I have a bill to fix
Medicare. I’ve a bill to fix Social Security. For both of them
you have to gradually raise the age. If you’re not willing to do
that, nobody wants to do it, but if you’re not willing to
gradually raise the age, you’re not serious about fixing either
one of them.
QUICK: Senator, thank you.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Becky, may I…
QUINTANILLA: This is the– well, we’re going to
take a break. We want to save time for closing statements after
the break.
So this is the Republican presidential debate
in Boulder, and we’ll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(APPLAUSE)
QUICK: Welcome back to Boulder, Colorado and
the Republican presidential debate right here on CNBC.
Governor Huckabee, you wanted to respond to
the points that Senator Rand Paul was just making when it comes
to Social Security. Your time, sir.
HUCKABEE: Well, and specifically to Medicare,
Becky, because 85 percent of the cost of Medicare is chronic
disease. The fact is if we don’t address what’s costing so much,
we can’t throw enough money at this. And it’s why I’ve continued
to focus on the fact that we need to declare war on the four big
cost drivers because 80 percent of all medical costs in this
country are chronic disease. We don’t have a health care crisis
in America, we have a health crisis.
And until we deal with the health of Americans
and do what we did with polio — when I was a little kid, we
eradicated it. You know how much money we spent on polio last
year in America? We didn’t spend any. We’ve saved billions of
dollars.
You want to fix Medicare? Focus on the
diseases that are costing us the trillions of dollars.
Alzheimers, diabetes, heart disease and cancer. Eradicate those
and you fix Medicare and you’ve fixed America, its economy and
you’ve made people’s lives a heck of a lot better.
BUSH: Becky —
QUICK: Thank you, Governor.
(APPLAUSE)
BUSH: — the governor’s absolutely right. But
we also need to reform Medicare and Social Security. We can’t
just allow it to continue on its current path the way that
Hillary Clinton wants to do because there’ll be major reductions
in benefits in the next decade if we do nothing.
I have a concrete plan to do just that, which
allows people to keep HSAs to encourage savings, it allows for
people that are retiring with Social Security to be able to get
a minimum of 125 percent of the poverty level so that there is a
baseline that in this generous country of ours no one goes
below.
HARWOOD: Governor Bush, Mr. Trump says that he
is capable of growing the economy so much that Social Security
and Medicare don’t have to be touched. Do you want to explain
how that is going to happen, Mr. Trump?
TRUMP: Yes, it’s very simple. We’re going to
make a really dynamic economy from what we have right now, which
is not at all dynamic. We’re going to bring jobs back from
Japan, we’re going to bring jobs back from China, we’re going to
bring, frankly, jobs back from Mexico where, as you probably
saw, Nabisco is leaving Chicago with one of their biggest
plants, and they’re moving it to Mexico.
We’re going to bring jobs and manufacturing
back. We’re going to cut costs. We’re going to save Social
Security, and we’re going to save Medicare.
(UNKNOWN): Governor, you just heard him.
BUSH: You have to reform Social Security, and
the simple way to do it is to make sure that the wealthiest
don’t receive the same benefits as people that are lower-income.
And make sure you enhance savings in the
private market. The idea of 401(k)s. I have a small business
that I set up. It took — it took an arm and a leg to be able to
set up a 401(k). Because of all the federal mandates and federal
laws, it was too expensive.
We need to incent private savings and make
sure that Social Security is protected for those that have it.
KASICH: John.
BUSH: But the idea that you can’t — that
you’re just gonna grow your way out of this — I have a plan to
grow the economy at 4 percent, but you’re gonna have to make
adjustments for both Medicare and Social Security.
(UNKNOWN): Governor Kasich, do you want 30
seconds?
KASICH: I wanna tell you, in my state, we took
Medicaid, the hardest program to control, and we took it from a
10 percent growth rate to 2.5 percent without taking one person
off the rolls or cutting one single benefit.
And so much of what we did — to force
competition, to use technology, to stand down the special
interest groups — can you imagine taking Medicaid from 10 to 2.5
percent?
We can take many of those same procedures, we
can apply it to Medicare. We can make a stronger program. But I
agree with Jeb, you can’t just do this by growing the economy.
You can’t grow your way out of demographics.
But we can give people better health care. And
finally, on health care, why don’t we start treating — keep
giving…
QUICK: Governor.
KASICH: …incentives for people to keep people
healthy, rather than giving the incentives to treat them when
they’re sick?
QUICK: Governor, thank you.
Senator Paul, let’s go back to you. Do these
solutions sound like they work?
PAUL: Say again?
QUICK: Do these solutions sound like they
would work?
PAUL: You can’t do nothing. And that’s what I
hear from some people, “we’ll do nothing and it will just be
fixed.” That’s absurd, and I think people who don’t want to fix
it, really, or unwilling to take the chance to say, “something
has to change,” are missing the boat here.
The age will have to gradually rise, there is
no question. It’s the only way you fix Medicare, the only way
you fix Social Security. You will also have to means-test the
benefits and declare there’s not enough money.
It isn’t “I put money in, I’m getting it
back.” There is no money, it’s a stack of paper. There is no
money in the Social Security account. There is no money in the
Medicare account. There’s only a promise to pay by the next
generation, and the next generation’s not big enough to pay it.
(CROSSTALK)
(UNKNOWN): …to deal with this. We did it 200
days ago.
HARWOOD: Hold on, Governor. I’ve got a
question for — for Dr. Carson.
CARSON: About Medicare?
HARWOOD: Yes. You’ve said that you would like
to replace Medicare with a system of individual family savings
accounts, so that families could cover their own expenses.
Obviously, that would be a very controversial
idea. Explain how that would work, exactly.
CARSON: Well, first of all the — the plan
gives people the option of — of opting out. But I think they
will see a very good option here. You know, the annual Medicare
budget is over $600 billion. And there are 48 million people
involved — 40 million, 65 and over, and 8 million other.
Divide that out. That comes out to $12,500 for
each one. Now, I can tell you there are a lot of private-sector
things that you could do with $12,500, which will get you a lot
more than you get from this government program.
And that’s really a theme of a lot of the
things that I’m talking about. How do we utilize our intellect
rather than allowing the government to use its, quote,
“intellect,” in order to help us to be able to live healthier
and better lives?
It was never intended that the government
should be in every aspect of our lives. This is a country that
is of, for and by the people.
QUICK: Thank you, Dr. Carson.
Governor?
CHRISTIE: And — and — and I — you know, Ben is
absolutely right in saying that what we don’t need to do is to
send more money to Washington, D.C. to fix this problem.
And that’s what you’ll hear from Hillary
Clinton — and I’ve already heard from her — is that, send more
money in Social Security, send more money in Medicare taxes,
send more money for Medicaid, and that’s gonna solve the
problem.
What we know is we’re living longer. That’s a
blessing. It’s a blessing that we’re living longer, so we have
to increase the retirement age to reflect that blessing.
We need to make sure that people understand,
as Jeb said before, that if you’ve done extraordinarily well in
this country, do you want them to take more out of your taxes
now and think they’re gonna give it back to you later? Or would
you rather take less later on?
QUINTANILLA: Senator Rubio…
HARWOOD: Governor, do you also think that…
QUINTANILLA: …yeah, I just wanted (inaudible).
HARWOOD: …that Dr. Carson’s right, that we can
replace Medicare with individual savings accounts?
CHRISTIE: No. No. What I said was that I think
that Dr. Carson’s ideas are good ideas. They’re not my ideas,
and I don’t necessarily agree with all of them.
But this is what you’re seeing in the
Republican debate that you didn’t see in that Democrat debate.
You didn’t see it for a minute. You didn’t see
these kind of ideas being batted around, and being batted around
in a way that’s civil and smart and that’s trying to help to
inform the voter out there.
What you saw was a parade of, “I’ll give you
this for free; I’ll give you that for free.”
Let me tell you, everybody, when they say they
want to give it to you for free, keep your hands on your wallets
because they’re coming to you to pay for it. And that’s why I
think these ideas up here are great, and that’s what we should
have is have more discussions like this and less gotcha.
(CROSSTALK)
QUINTANILLA: I want to give you 30 seconds
here.
RUBIO: I want to take off from that point and
argue the same thing. And that is that one of the things you’re
watching tonight are 11 quality candidates debating an important
issue. The Republican Party is blessed to have 11 good
candidates, (inaudible) 10 good candidates. The Democrats can’t
even come up with one.
And on this issue of the Medicare in
particular, it’s important because they’re going to demagogue
what we’re saying here tonight. Everyone up here tonight that’s
talking about reforms, I think and I know for myself I speak to
this, we’re all talking about reforms for future generations.
Nothing has to change for current beneficiaries. My mother is on
Medicare and Social Security. I’m against anything that’s bad
for my mother.
(LAUGHTER)
So, we’re talking about — we’re talking about
reform for people like me and people like Senator Cruz, as he
talked about earlier, who are years away from retirement that
have a way to plan for these changes, and way that’s very
reasonable. And it’s not too much to ask of our generation after
everything our parents and our grandparents did for us.
FIORINA: John, I — if I — a lot of people have
jumped in here. I’d like to jump in. A lot of people have jumped
in here.
HARWOOD: Mrs. Fiorina, we’re right at the end
of our time.
FIORINA: I understand.
HARWOOD: You all wanted us to limit
(inaudible).
All right. Go ahead.
FIORINA: I would just say that…
(LAUGHTER)
… I would just say this, we’ve heard a lot of
great ideas up here, and I agree with what Senator Rubio said.
Every election we talk about this. Every election we talk about
Medicare and Social Security reform. It never happens.
I would like to start with a basic. Let us
actually go to zero- based budgeting so we know where the money
is being spent. It’s kind of basic. There is a bill sitting in
the House that would actually pass and have us go to zero-based
budgeting so we know where every dime of your money is being
spent instead of only talking about how much more we’re going to
spend year after year after year.
My point is this. While there are lots of good
ideas for reform, we have never tackled the basics. And we
finally need to tackle the basics to cut this government down to
size and hold it accountable. So let’s start by knowing where
your money is being spent by the federal government.
HARWOOD: We have now reached the point in the
program where candidates are going to give their closing
statements, 30 seconds apiece. We’re going to go right to left
and start with you, Senator Paul.
PAUL: Liberty thrives when government is
small. I want a government so small I can barely see it. I want
a government so small that the individual has a chance to thrive
and prosper. I think, though, government is too big now. And
what you’re going to see in Washington this week is
establishment Republicans have made an agreement with the
president to raise the debt ceiling in an unlimited fashion; no
limit to the debt ceiling raise.
This is extraordinary. It’s extraordinarily
wrong. You’ll see me on the floor of the Senate tomorrow
filibustering this and saying enough is enough, no more debt.
HARWOOD: Governor Christie?
CHRISTIE: I want to talk to the folks at home.
I want to ask you: Are you fed up with how Washington taxes you?
Are you fed up with how Washington wastes your money? Are you
concerned like I am that the debt and deficits of Washington,
D.C. are endangering America’s future?
I’ve got one more question for you then. Are
you serious about this election? Because if you are, you need to
elect someone who’s deadly serious about changing this culture.
I am deadly serious about changing this culture. I changed it in
New Jersey. I’m deadly serious about doing this job the right
way.
I’m prepared. I’m tested. I’m ready. And I
want to make this our government. For the people who say we
can’t do it, I say hell no, we can do it together.
HARWOOD: Thank you, Governor.
Senator Cruz?
CRUZ: You know, everyone here talks about the
need to take on Washington. The natural next question is who
actually has done so. Who actually has stood up not just to
Democrats, but to leaders in our own party? When millions of
Americans rose up against Obamacare, I was proud to lead that
fight. When millions of Americans rose up against amnesty, I was
proud to lead that fight. When millions of Americans rose up
against Planned Parenthood, I was proud to lead that fight.
If people are promising they’re going to take
on Washington and cronyism, you need to look to who has been
doing it. In my family, my dad fled oppression in Cuba to come
to America. Freedom is personal for me, and I will always keep
my word and fight for freedom.
HARWOOD: Thank you, Senator.
Mrs. Fiorina?
FIORINA: You know, every election we hear a
lot of talk. We hear a lot of good plans. We hear actually a lot
of good intentions. But somehow for decades, nothing really has
changed. What we need now is a proven leader who has produced
results. That’s how you go from secretary to CEO. You lead and
you produce results. I will cut this government down to size and
hold it accountable, simplify the tax code, roll back the
regulations that have been spewing out of Washington, D.C. for
50 years.
I may not be your dream candidate just yet,
but I can assure you I am Hillary Clinton’s worst nightmare. And
in your heart of hearts, you cannot wait to see a debate between
Hillary Clinton and Carly Fiorina. I will tell you this, I will
beat Hillary Clinton. And with your vote and your support and
your prayers, I will lead with the citizens of this great nation
the resurgence of this great nation.
HARMAN: Thank you, Mrs. Fiorina.
Dr. Carson?
CARSON: I just want to thank all my colleagues
here for being civil, and not falling for the traps. And, I also
just want to thank the audience for being attentive, and
noticing the questions, and the noticing the answers. And, this
is what I am finding throughout America.
People are waking up because it is going to be
us who will determine the direction of our country. And, it was
made for we the people, we are the ones who decide who we are,
and we should never give away the values and principles that
made America into a great nation for the sake of political
correctness.
(APPLAUSE)
HARWOOD: Mr. Trump?
TRUMP: Our country doesn’t win anymore. We
used to win, we don’t win anymore. We lose on trade. We lose
with ISIS. We lose with one of the worst deals I’ve ever seen
negotiated of any kind, that’s our recent catastrophe with Iran.
We don’t win.
Let me give you one quick example. These
folks, CNBC, they had it down at three, three and a half hours.
I just read today in the New York Times, $250,000 for a 30
second ad. I went out and said, it’s ridiculous. Nobody — I
could stand up here all night. Nobody wants to watch three and a
half, or three hours. It was a back sacrifice, and I have to
hand it to Ben.
We called Ben, he was with me 100%. We called
in, we said, that’s it. We’re not doing it. They lost a lot of
money, everybody said it couldn’t be done. Everybody said it was
going to be three hours, three and a half, including them, and
in about two minutes I renegotiated it so we can get the hell
out of here. Not bad.
(APPLAUSE)
TRUMP: And, I’ll do that with the country. We
will make America great again. And, thank you everybody. Just
for the record.
HARWOOD: Just for the record, the debate was
always going to be two hours. Senator Rubio?
TRUMP: That’s not right. That is absolutely
not right. You know that. That is not right.
MALE: Thank you.
HARWOOD: Senator Rubio.
RUBIO: You know, America doesn’t owe me
anything. I have a debt to America I’ll never repay. This isn’t
just the country I was born in, this is the nation that
literally changed the history of my family. My parents in this
country were able to give me the chance to do all the things
they never did. We call that the American Dream, although, it’s
built on the universal dream of a better life.
The fact that it’s happened for so many people
here throughout our history, that’s what makes us special. But,
now for millions of Americans, it’s slipping away. And, we have
a government and leaders in government that are completely out
of touch, and that’s why I’m running for president. Because we
can’t just save the American Dream, we can expand it to reach
more people, and change more lives than ever before.
And, that’s why tonight I’m asking you for
your vote.
HARWOOD: Thank you, Senator. Governor Bush?
BUSH: America’s at a crossroads. The D.C.
politicians continue to make things worse. I have a proven
record of success, 32 years in business, and 8 years as Governor
of the state of Florida.
I will change the culture in Washington, just
as I changed the culture in Tallahassee. I will do so in a way
that will bring people together. We need a unifier, not a
cynical divider in chief, and that’s exactly what I will do.
Imagine a country where people are lifted out
of poverty again. Imagine a country where the middle class can
get rising income again. I know we can do this because we’re
still the most extraordinary country on the face of the Earth.
HARWOOD: Thank you, Governor. Governor
Huckabee.
HUCKABEE: You know, I know to a lot of people
in the media, this is just a great big game, and we’re the
players. And, we come out here, and we do our thing. And,
sometimes we’re held up in contempt by people who write columns,
but, I guarantee you to every person on this stage there’s
something deep inside of us that would cause us to give up our
livelihoods and step out on this stage and fight for the people
of America.
I’ve got five grandkids. I do not want to walk
my five grandkids through the charred remains of a once great
country called America, and say, “Here you go, $20 trillion
dollars of debt. Good luck making something out of this mess.”
And, for those of us who are serious enough to
run for president, think long and hard why we’re here, and
hopefully you’ll know we’re not here for ourselves. We honest to
god are here to get this country back on track. I know this, I
certainly am.
HARWOOD: Thank you…
HUCKABEE: …Thank you.
HARWOOD: Governor Kasich?
KASICH: I was on morning Joe at a town hall
and a young student stood up and said, “Can I still be
idealistic?”
I said, absolutely, you can still change the
world. And, you know the old inscription, if you save one life,
you’ve changed the world. Folks, we have a problem here with the
leadership in Washington, but I’ll tell you another problem. We
need to rebuild our families. We need to have stronger families.
We need to know who our neighbors are. We need to come together
as a country because we have to realize that America is great,
not from the top-down. Oh yeah, we want to elect a good
president, but America is great from the bottom-up, and the
bottom-up is us in our families, in our communities, in our
neighborhoods. We will renew America if we work together, and I
am totally confident that we will. And God bless America.
(APPLAUSE)
HARWOOD: Thank you, Governor.
QUINTANILLA: That concludes tonight’s debate.
On behalf of my colleagues Becky Quick, John Harwood, Sharon
Epperson, Rick Santelli and Jim Cramer, we’d like to our host,
the University of Colorado at Boulder, the Republican National
Committee, the candidates and, of course, tonight’s audience.
CNBC’s Kelly Evans and Joe Kernan pick up our
continuing coverage.